Lost Battlefields - Historians Joseph P. Farrell and Igor Witkowski First Chat

• Source: YouTube
• Channel and host: Lost Battlefields w Tino Struckmann, hosted by Tino Struckmann
• Guests: Joseph P. Farrell and Igor Witkowski
• Published: 2024-11-29
• Duration: 1:00:40
• Date sourced: 2026-09-13
• Audio SHA-256: 464ccbb4d2a3b570e6c408ab81d98007b368a5fd2f197a4ecb52357eef7a9d11
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• Analysis: ../../queries/2026-09-12-how-accurate-is-the-kammler-connection; ../../sources/magenta-1933-crash-claim

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TL;DW

Tino Struckmann brings Joseph P. Farrell and Igor Witkowski together to discuss alleged Nazi secret weapons, especially Die Glocke, the story that helped connect Kammler lore to UFO and antigravity claims. At 5:15, Witkowski says an unnamed person from Polish intelligence gave him fragments of the Bell story and showed him documents he could not publish; he says he assembled the story and then sought related material in archives. The discussion expands into claims of gravity control through rotating plasma, a surviving German organization holding advanced technology in South America, and Apollo missions aided by exotic propulsion. At 54:26, Witkowski connects a suspected German installation near the Soviet-Norwegian border to his recollection of Admiral Byrd warning during Operation Highjump about enemy craft able to fly between the poles.

Transcript

How are you? Pretty good, Igor. It's nice finally to see and meet you, even if it's long distance.

I know. I can't believe the two of you have not spoken yet. Or before. Well, we've exchanged emails and you know, and letters back and forth, but we've never actually met like this face to face.

And it was uh quite a long time ago. It was quite a long time ago. It was when you're um you were working on Axis of the World, I think.

Maybe 10 years ago or more or more. Yeah, at least. Yeah. So you have ten years of historical catching up to do.

I mean I I I I I no longer am doing any much much research on this. Uh huh. I'm I'm writing books uh still, but on on different topics.

Well, you probably still gonna have to do a little bit of backtracking in some of the books that you wrote, um, because there's a whole lot of and you you haven't really done a whole lot of uh interviews

out in in the Western English, have you? Other besides TV and yeah, and I I mean I took part in uh in some documentaries, but uh not too many interviews.

That's what I'm and a lot of people well every for those of peop people who who everybody should know who you are because you are you're the person that one back in the day wrote this book that kicked

off so much research, and oh yeah, that for for for all of us, and I don't know how it ended up with me climbing through tunnels all over Europe, but to try to find what you found.

But for people who are starting today, this book is still selling, and you have a second version. Did the second edition come out in English yet? Uh there is an extended edition, it's it's not edited in so I mean so well, it's it's in flexi cover, but uh it should be available still.

It's extended. Outstanding. Cool. Now um you have to for for new that means for new people, uh younger people that we are trying to generate a little curiosity in their minds.

Just a moment. Somebody's calling to my door. Moment, moment, sorry.

Hello, hello. I figured we need to have Igor tell a little bit about how he found that boat because of the book because a lot of people they probably don't know.

Well, actually, actually, that book um he originally reasoned released the Bell part of that book in five volumes that were in Polish that were uh I think eventually what he used to compile together in truth about the Wunderwaff.

And the only reason I know that is my publisher David Childress had copies of those books. Really? Yeah. Um I don't I'm sorry, it's a courier. Just a moment, okay.

No worries, we're just talking about you. We're just we're just talking about you.

Yeah, it it when when uh truth about the Wunderwaffa came out, it was well, it kicked off Nick Cook's book, Hunt for Zero Point. Yeah. And Hunt for Zero Point, which is the book that I read, was the book that then took me to uh Truth about the Wunderwaffe.

And right about the time that uh Cook's book came out, Igor's book has finally been published in in English. I'm I'm I'm very sorry, I just got to put parcel.

No worries, I had a chance to redo the camera setup because it looked better this way. Um Igor, you have to tell the story of how the book of the Wunderwaffe came um came through, and you're probably gonna have to talk a little bit about how you discovered the Bell story as well, because so

much research and history and other books, and for some reason, every summer I crawl through tunnels looking for what you wrote about. How does that happen? So you go you gotta you gotta take people who have who don't may not know that story through the journey.

I mean it's uh but are you recording this? It yes. Okay. Uh it started long very long time ago. It's uh mid nineteen seven. I mean nineteen nineties, when I started to writing books uh about uh German secret weapons and something similar to to what Henry Stevens did uh back.

I mean, then. And uh it evolved. Uh eventually, after a couple of years, I was contacted by a guy from uh our secrets uh our our services, uh, who shared with me with me the the story Bell to Bell.

It was uh uh I would say bits and pieces of of the story. I had to glue it together, and uh uh because it was fascinating, and uh at the same time I couldn't publish uh the documents that I had that that I was shown.

Uh the ambition of my life, I at least at that stage, was to um verify it. I mean, I I started uh traveling to various archives, including in the United States, various archives, in various countries, in Germany.

Uh I was trying to do some research on this in Argentina as well, and in Poland, of course. And um

eventually, after after several years, I had uh quite an extensive archival experience, and uh I have uh two large uh drawers full of documents. Some of them uh relate to this story, and after this, which took uh several years, uh I was able to write this book that you showed, and later on I wrote uh several other ones on this, and uh

eventually I uh I I I have published a book titled The New Truth about Wunderwaffe, which uh came out only in Poland in Polish, but it's pretty very well I mean edited in uh very pretty uh hardcover and

so on. And uh it took me about I don't know, 15 or 20 years, or this order of magnitude. I don't remember exactly. But um what eventually something that started pretty uh modestly, I would say, uh ended up in something that uh I will dare to say nobody has done before.

I mean, such an approach to technological developments in uh scientific developments in the Third Reich uh that uh shows that it was uh eventually I I I one one may say that it presents something like a different model

of civilization, uh which has achieved very much, much more than people appreciate and know generally, because uh what they do know is something that was in production. But I also described something that was um in research in laboratories, which present at an entirely different level, uh pretty much unknown to this day.

And um, there are different approaches to physics, to making uh atomic weapons, for example, and other such uh things. So uh

I'm uh I mean uh it it has surprised the the uh the final result has has surprised me to uh to uh in uh a bit. But uh I I um it's over for me now.

Um I'm writing other books uh presently. We'll get to your other books, but you're not off the hook for this one just yet. Or for the foreseeable future of this day.

What did you find? Because there's a lot of people that uh uh fortunately, and I can very much also point to what Joseph have been doing and following up on this for the mass many years, that we get new people and younger

people who are waking up to the fact that history is not as black and white as it was written in 1945. And I think it's you got to share a little bit of what what what have you what was the things that you found that has surprised you the most?

Uh the thing that has surprised me the most in in in this stuff, I mean, was that uh I have found a document in which uh which refers to the scientists uh involved in this project because I was

uh looking for documents by by names of the people and uh in one of the documents um which refers to a case where uh one of these guys uh was arrested by the Gestapo during the war uh because

he said something dubious I would say and the institution in which in which he worked has uh prepared uh a a document stating document for the Gestapo and for the court stating that uh why he cannot be arrested

because he is involved in something of crucial importance to such a degree that they referred to a specific conference where this uh project has been officially labeled as if it would be some kind of a higher kind of

a secrecy, such as we have a secret top secret and so on uh in which this the it was labeled as decisive for the war and uh it was probably the most uh amazing thing to to me uh

uh while I was researching for sources on this. But uh

excuse me I didn't hear you what was the project he was working on what do we know uh he he was working on something uh that was um on on some powering system for for something which has not

been specified but I knew uh about him because he was mentioned in these documents about the bell the AEG the AEG document yes it was a research institute of the of the AEG in Berlin but one uh very

uh I would say breaking or breakthrough document has been found by uh uh a fellow researcher uh who is named Henry Stevens and he has uh uh written a book about uh Nazi secret projects I don't remember the

title exactly at this moment but uh yes I I may look at this. Hitler's secret weapons Hitler's suppressed and still secret weapons and so on uh in which he has um reproduced a document from the NARA archive near Washington in College Park near Washington uh it's a federal archive US archive uh

uh referring to one of the scientists uh involved in this in this in this works in this in this research uh where it is uh it is um uh I mean um specifically stated that uh the they were

working on controlling gravity on experimental approach to the to the general theory of relativity and uh it was achieved through plasma systems by spinning high uh high voltage uh ionized by high voltage plasma and so on so uh

it would it was fitting uh I mean filling the gap in in in in my puzzle. It was also

pretty much so. I I mean uh it was a confirmation that they were trying to control gravity through through plasma research and uh it it it's very important I mean huge uh yeah because uh normally nobody would would have believed that

such a uh approach was uh uh possible at all but uh it it is by the way uh supplemented in a in i in a way by um the fact that uh they had uh one outstanding scientist working

on gravity in Germany during the war uh whose name was um Pasquale Jordan you would spell it Jordan uh who later after the war after after the war uh who was uh he was a chairman of uh of

some foundation uh funding research on gravity in in the US after the war uh it it it he was a very important scientist uh about which uh I I mean about uh about his uh wartime activity is uh

uh to uh before it was uh c almost completely unknown. It it it's it resembles situ the situation of uh of other key scientists such as Hermann Obert who was a father of the rocket science I mean uh yeah uh theory of of racket flat flight for example uh

like uh Professor um Walter Gerlach was uh chairman of the Reichs uh Scientific Research Council for example and and and other such people such as Werner Heisenberg who was who you know uh discovered the the the fission of

uh of uh of uh uranium uh isotopes for example before the war uh uh it it from from the generally access accessible sources one may draw a conclusion that such a people were doing nothing during the war the

they were completely unknown persons but I I have discovered for example that Heisenberg has uh had did have uh his own research team in the in in the occupied Czechoslovakia or Czechia in the town Ustin nad Labem in

a former former mine uh taken over by DSS he was uh he had uh his own research team was working painlessly I mean continuously during the entire war on on on on other approaches to to to nuclear weapons

for example which is completely unknown in the West and uh uh um what I wanted to say is is that this Professor Pascual Jordan or Jordan as we would say um has published shortly after the war along with

uh French scientist uh theory I don't remember his first name uh a

kind of a theory of gravity theory and space time theory which was uh uh exploiting their uh

their work during the war and uh it was mathematically it was very complex and uh but he he almost got a Nobel prize for this uh but it it was it was uh uh I mean it didn't materialize

because uh his connections with the with the SS were uncovered in the meantime but uh uh they were um what uh I'm referring you here to this fact that uh a document has been discovered which shows that the

Germans were trying to control gravity in order to build a propulsion system. Uh um Pascual Jordan has developed uh an entire new theory of gravity during during the war uh which was for each i as as I mentioned almost got a he he almost got a Nobel prize after the war

in nineteen forty nine or nineteen fifty two I don't remember exactly when it it was but uh it's uh what what started emerging after my extensive work after some years is the is that uh entire new i would

say levels or disciplines of their scientific and technological research started emerging uh out of this uh quite amazing in some cases I think that's one of the telling points about what happened what were they doing right after the

war I always used the example of Kurtna who in nineteen forty seven patented uh nuclear propulsion for large ships where did he come up with that idea in the two years where you weren't doing any research I wonder

exactly exactly it it uh one may assume that probably it didn't it it it hasn't come out of the blue sky you know it was based on on on on what they were doing during the war now it's

interesting that now I have on Heisenberg I always had the thought because I've been to I've been to Gotth I've been to Stadilm and I've been to Heigelock and when I went to Heigeloch to me I look at

Heicheloch as a diversion I don't look at Heigelock as a genuine example of or or try to set things up even Stadilm was more elaborate than that. I see it as this is what the Americans need to find to be able to come out and say that the Germans couldn't didn't do anything, and the story.

That's even the floor is crooked. There's nothing in Hikylock that looks like a genuine trump. Not even shielding. There's not even shielding in the damn thing. Now the the the the problem is such that uh uh the uh intelligence research teams plundering Germany after the war, looking for scientists and for technology and so on, uh they did assume they did take an assumption a

priori that uh what they are looking for must be some kind of uh uh equivalent of the US Manhattan project. Exactly. Which wasn't the case simply because it it was so uh uncentralized, there were various institutions working on this quite independently.

There were very many research projects uh relating to nuclear weapons, for example, in Germany. And Heigerlock was just uh uh uh a byproduct of one of these uh thread, but one of many.

Uh even DSS had uh their own uh uh nuclear program. Were related to the anti gravitational well, was it the same scientist, or did that did the scientist we talked about uh Joseph talk, you talked about the the Camelostop and how they exchanged information?

Uh not much is known about it because you know the SS had such a in reverse brackets advantage that they were they they could afford uh destroying the the entire workforce because it consisted mostly of uh of the

inmates from the concentration camps. And even in uh in a crucial cases, in a very important cases, they didn't hesitate to to kill their own German staff. So uh they were able, the SS only was able to uh maintain secrecy even of large projects uh in this way, in this way.

So it's um it's uh still um, I mean uh mur murky in a way, uh uh what they were doing. My contention is that there was a a communicate there, must have been communication before the end of the war with American intelligence, probably Dulles, and some of the SS, some of these research projects were handed over.

Like Kamala destroyed Pinamunda completely before the Russians. They found nothing there. He evacuated the scientists, he handed over Duor Mittelbao intact. He got to qua he walked to Bergistal before the Russians looted that, without that being destroyed, uh before the Americans got there.

The only reason why Kamla survived now, I'm just using him for an example, not necessarily him, is because he has he he has traded some of the secrets for for his life and the the life of other, you

know. That that's what what it it m there must have been a deal made, otherwise they would have blown everything up and killed all the scientists. I I have no doubt about it.

It's obvious, yes. So, what happened to all these? Where where are we today? And I know Joseph, I know you got stuff on this. Did we take did the German anti gravitational research did that turn into the secret space program today?

Uh not really. Uh the most important things uh were not sold or traded. Right. Uh they have been uh evacuated to South America, right? And uh they are still keeping a kind of uh finger on on the pulse in this case.

It's still an active story. Yes. I I did have some contacts with the Germans from out there. Yeah. And uh it confirms me to that uh it's uh they they still been some hopes on this in uh that they will use it in the future.

So uh uh I mean they they were very uh were informed. Uh they could tell what I was doing and what I was about to do in the future, although I didn't write about this in the in any book at the time yet, for example.

And uh what what has emerged from this is that uh they they they do have it, they keep it, and they they they they want to use it, maybe not in uh not in such a sense that they

will uh wage a war with this, but they uh uh they will they are about to use it as a trump card in uh in a way. Uh in a in in some g in some kind of a game, you know, for the uh they that that they uh uh uh uh uh uh have in in pr in their plans.

Is that them? Is that the who who are was as it's interesting to see who is them? There's a lot of Germans that evacuated after the war, ended up in South America.

There was a underground Nazi. I hate I hate the term Nazi because it doesn't really serve the purpose, but there was an underground Nazi organization. We had the Spina, we had all the the post war uh you wrote a lot about that, Joseph.

Eventually the old guard died off. Um some went back to kick start the EU into back into a greater. I'm I'm contending on that. But where did the other people where who are these people?

Because there must be an international underground organization at this point. You know, the the paradox, i if I may uh reply to this. Uh the paradox is such that uh I mean, wartime story or wartime technology or documents in the United States or in Poland or in Germany and anywhere, is uh uh however we would look at this, uh it it

will be only a history without without any you know uh um translation into our uh reality in which we live, material reality. But out there in Argentina or in even in Chile, uh it's a quite a different story because there were entire companies, even large companies, capital built on this, and this capital, these uh enterprises still exist, and the case

is alive in a way. You cannot touch it without risking, you know, uh uh returning with holes in the in the bag. Because uh it it's it's uh it's something that is still quite organized because they have to defend themselves uh in order to maintain all this status quo, this uh what they have.

Uh uh these are family fortunes uh continued by uh second or third generation. But the but the money on which it it was built is still active and is still sensitive in a way.

You know, you have you have to you have to be watchful in if you if you are in such a situation. So they are still organized, they still have connections with other with secret services of various countries, quite deep connections.

Uh um, and uh they still have influence. Their influence out there is I would say it's something comparable to the situation of Jews in the United States. It's like it's something like that, if I may say so.

What say you, Joseph? Well, I uh you know me. I I I basically have taken Igor's research and and in a certain sense tried to to reverse engineer it.

So I I came to the same conclusions that he just outlined that that this organization, through all of its corporate fronts, continued in in uh South America and to a certain extent Mesoamerica.

Uh that that a lot of these German families, it was a generational, intergenerational transfer of capital, that they were still engaged in this research. I think and and like Igor, I think again, they are still extremely influential.

You know, I've I've been I've been making that part of my, you know, what I call the Nazi International. Call it whatever you want to call it. Um, and I also agree with Igor in that I do not think nothing, nothing has led me to the conclusion that all of this German wartime anti gravity research became the basis for the American secret space program.

I do think, I do think that there was some sort of negotiated deal during the Apollo moon missions between NASA and and this German contingent to get their hands on some of that technology because I absolutely firmly believe

that that technology was what enabled us to get to the moon and then off of it once we got there. Nothing about the moon landing to me says that this was all accomplished with rockets.

Um, you know, and I've I've outlined my case for that. So I I'm again in agreement with Igor. Now, I I do think that what what Igor outlined in The Truth about the Wunderwaff, and then what Nick Cook, you know, Nick Cook read Igor's book, and then he he went on to publish uh The Hunt for

Zero Point. And what Cook found, taking Igor's research as his springboard, when he got into the American space program, he discovered that there was this whole nest of anti gravity research in the United States that no one wanted to talk

about. And I think I think what happened is that somehow the American security apparatus as I think also the Soviet security apparatus got wind of what the Germans were really up to and decided well we've got to find out

and try to reduplicate as much of it as possible. So I think I think in a certain sense what the Germans were up to during World War II became the seed stock or the feedstock of of all of these black projects in the United States and the Soviet

Union. I can't see any other way of rationalizing it. But I I agree with Igor the Germans tried to keep as much of that top level sophisticated exotic technology in their own hands.

While I'm at it can I ask Igor some questions that I'm dying to you would I'm dying to ask him. All right Igor you mentioned uh Pascual Jordan and you've obviously uncovered some some information about his wartime gravity theories and and Jordan I think it folks to give you to give you an idea of the significance of Pascual

Jordan Yordon was one of the key founders of quantum mechanics you simply cannot do anything in quantum mechanics without bumping into Pascual Yordon. He is a first rank theoretical physicist no two ways about it.

And yet here's this guy publishing this strange theory about the earth increasing mass and density and so on and so forth. And what I want to ask you you have mentioned in your in your books Igor

the following scientists and I'm wondering if you have connected them together or if you found out any more information about them. Is there or have you ever run into a connection between Pascual Jordan and Ot Christian Hilgenberg that's a name I'm sure that you've bumped I have never never found anything such like this.

All right no have you ever found anything connecting uh Burkhart Heim to uh Heisenberg's team not because Heim was uh uh he was blind in uh he was blinded in an accident in the nineteen forty four and nineteen

forty f or nineteen forty five I I don't remember now. I may be wrong as to the exact year. But uh he was an assistant in the laboratory uh at the age of about fifteen at that then so he was too young to play to play any important role in the in the in the but on the

other hand perhaps some of the things on which he has developed his break breaking theory later on yes maybe it was based connected to it on on some works that were left over from the you know from the

other older people. I'm so glad to hear you say that because that's exactly what I think Haim's theory is is based on yeah it's good it's very likely because it's uh quite uh you know unconceivable for him to develop it from

this from scratch right uh from the very beginning in a good in a relatively quick short period of time. Okay. So uh it's it's very likely it's very likely but nevertheless it's obvious for me as well that uh the Germans from the very beginning were uh approaching this uh issue of uh controlling gravity generating uh anti gravity and

building uh building a propulsion system right from from the quantum uh point of view you know all right you know uh Einstein's theory uh was for them uh a Jewish science right it was condemned right so uh uh

given given the fact that they did have uh their own foundations quantum physics right uh it's um it's uh it's hard to it's hard to imagine for for them to develop such a technology based based on Einstein's theory.

I I want to get back to that in just a minute but there's one more detailed question. In your truth about the Wunderwaffe you mentioned a scientist at the University of Königsberg whose first name was Elizabeth I can't remember her last name.

Adler Adler thank you Elizabeth I I have never found any confirmation that such a that such a person existed yeah that's been my problem yeah in in fact uh I have been suggest I I was it was suggested

to me by a guy from uh our services which had uh um quite an experience in in in in in this uh topics that uh it might have not been uh a true name because uh uh the DSS

uh as part of their compartmentalization and other you know uh efforts to to conceal their most secret activities uh they were there the uh the this guy has pointed to to to the fact that uh my attention to

the fact that uh there were there were cases where the scientists had uh different names used within the institution and in a correspondence uh with other institutions for example so uh it it is likely that uh it was

not uh the uh German I I mean it was not uh a a real person it might have been some somebody else but I have been uh I I I have received a suggestion by the way that it

was uh uh a woman uh a mat mathematician uh known as Maria Reicher who has uh uncovered the petroglyphs from the Nazca in Peru because she gave she was a mathematician which worked during the war as far as

I remember if I you uh you may correct me or somebody later on may correct me if I'm wrong but uh uh I I did have uh sugg uh have received such a suggestion that Maria Reichel might have

been this uh Elizabeth Adler because uh there there were some things that uh she was saying shortly after the war that suggested that uh she was um involved in some secret project during the war in in Germany but

uh I I cannot confirm it I'm I'm I'm mentioning just it it just as a curiosity and if if she was a mathematician and involved in things like runes and Nazca lines and so on and so forth yeah

if the SS is going to have her involved in something for sure um an Arabic connection to her as well yeah an on an Arabic connection all right I want to ask you protecting yeah I want to ask

you a loaded question Igor um you have in your in your truth about the Wunderwaffa and then the books that you published that kind of led up to the truth I I I actually saw some of them my

publisher had some of your previous books before the truth about the wunderwaffe that were published in Polish uh five volumes of of uh different things you remember those um the the thing I want to ask you is you

have alluded to the fact that the Germans during the war they rejected relativity because that was quote unquote Jewish science. And so as a result of that the only solid scientific foundation that they had to fall back on was quantum mechanics and therefore they're approaching all of this uh work that they're doing not from the standpoint of of

a theoretical physics having anything to do with general relativity but having everything to do with trying to extrapolate all the implications of quantum mechanics that they can. So my question is do you think that that may account for the breathtaking technological and for that matter theoretical development that you've uncovered in your truth about the Wunderwaffe particularly with respect to anti gravity do you think that

may have had something to do with it uh it it might have been the reason why has they have moved so far in this research but uh uh my impression is that uh this uh direction has died after

the war because you know it hasn't been continued uh or pe or or picked up by anyone in uh any scientist any western scientists why do you think that is is it because the the post war West is

still trying to incorporate general relativity I yes they pretty much do you it's it's it's an

I mean uh quite an unusual I I I don't know how to name it situation that uh uh science uh uh the Western s I mean western science supposedly has is developing at a tremendous rate but on on

the other hand they they they they still rely on uh on a theory which is uh without any doubt uh incomplete yes uh or over hundred years old and uh be despite uh uh uh you know a great

number of signals from various directions that uh suggest that uh there is a link between electromagnetism uh and uh and gravity for example right they they still reject it because they they do base it on on the you

know on the grounds of the of the Einstein's theory. Uh it's uh why they do they you know why they still they are stuck in it um uh it's uh it's I'm afraid a psychological problem I I yeah I agree I don't I don't I don't know exactly

but uh there there are other directions uh which point to the to such a possibility that uh gravity may be gravitation may may be induced from electromagnetism well for example for for for example by what is going on

inside the superconductors for example superconductors yeah there there are many directions so the the science just our modern science just doesn't see that because they they refer they see it to the filter of the Einstein theory.

Yeah I I think the thing that you the other thing that you pointed out in your research Igor that is so um central and crucial to the story of this this Nazi technological development is plasma.

In other words you you zeroed in on on on what I think are the two basic fundamental things that were driving this technology quantum mechanics and plasma physics. In fact uh you spent you spent a great deal of your time in truth about the Wunderwaffe writing about the bell in relationship to plasma studies you even showed the example of the plasma trap there at the University

of Warsaw you know to to show the similarity of of the of the type of technology that you were talking about. And I think I think again that plasma physics especially is is where they've had the blinders on because you know you've got Richter down in Argentina and he's playing around with with plasmas and doing again as you pointed

out a rotating experiment in plasma that no one else is thinking to do. Yeah the the there was a German uh in in his team out there yeah uh which has mentioned in in uh in an article uh later on uh his name was Ehrenberg uh he was mentioned that uh as

a byproduct supposedly by product of the Richter's experiments they were some quote quoting uh terrifying ball lightnings generate created generated so it it's uh it's quite uh close to the to the idea of spinning plasma you know yeah

in but may I explain shortly why this uh you know this connection with plasma is so is so important. Sure. You know uh what has been demonstrated uh demonstrated in uh in various experiments in various countries is that uh uh spinning superconductor in a strong magnetic field uh creates some kind of anti gravitational effect uh namely diminishing gravity

by one percent two percent nib cook has mentioned that uh potkletnoff you yes Eugene Potletnov was working the later on in in Japan in in the in Toshiba and he was able supposedly to to to diminish the the

the gravity by five percent but generally uh it's about idea the the idea that uh which uh uh takes play it takes place inside the con superconductor that it you know uh the magnetic it it completely separates magnetic

fields from each other or the fields inside the con superconductor from the other external fields it's 100% you know separation and uh uh you know there is a problem with superconductors such that uh they are not very mechanically

resistant they cannot nor nor they they cannot be spinned with uh very high velocities nor they can withstand uh very strong magnetic fields but uh with with plasma it's uh uh it doesn't occur you know because uh you

can spin plasma with tremendous speeds close to the speed of of light for example uh the the the plasma vortex compresses itself yep it there there is no centrifugal forces for example they they're a compet they are compensated

by the phenomena uh could taking place in s inside so uh uh the uh uh there is a it it it is possible to to to to create uh uh density of energy within plasma and velocities uh higher

by many orders of magnitudes uh than uh what uh when compared with the with the superconductors for example and uh uh it's it if if you uh if you may imagine that uh for example we uh if we

can achieve one percent of two per or two percent reduction of gravity uh by the superconductant uh then in plasma you may uh you may spin the plasma thousands of times uh uh faster and uh create uh electromagnetic

fields thousands or hundreds of thousands of times stronger than in superconductors so that's why it is uh it is the key but it it is a tricky you know uh idea because you you as in uh as in

very uh in every um plasma uh accelerator there is a problem that uh if if if you achieve such a speed of heavy ions you must uh ensure that there are no collisions of these ions with the with

the general structure because it generates uh uh uh radioactivity generat you know neutrons and and so on so it's it's uh technologically it's it's quite difficult but it's a it it shows these experiments generally show that plasma is

promising that's what what I wanted to add. Let me let me let me ask you another leading question if if the Germans were making some sort of connection between plasma and anti gravity as you suggested earlier is this the reason why we have yet to see

any real fusion breakthrough because there would be an inherent anti gravity connection between any controlled fusion breakthrough because it's based in plasma of course and and gravity in other words are they are they deliberately withholding any real breakthroughs

because they really haven't figured out how are we going to keep the gravity anti gravity genie in the bottle I hope I'm making some sort of sense there. Yes you do but uh I I I just don't know that I I I was never wondering about it and I don't now I know little about uh uh you know uh fusion uh approaches to to to fusion

in plasma. Okay. How far advanced towards these does it seem that the German scientists were at that time that that we officially know of in mainstream science science journals what have come out that in the year the years after uh after

the war of new research I always found if they did something during the war we could look at what they did then in official mainstream science uh within five ten years after so what do we what have officially

been acknowledged that they knew or that we officially there is no confirmation that that they have finished it uh I mean there is no any interesting there there there there are descriptions of a complete propulsion system not just

the bow because it was uh I assume that it was uh something part of something larger but there there are descriptions but you know it's it's all under unverifiable uh the closest i i I would say on my

rather intuition intuition I would say that they were quite close on the on the brink of making it and producing it but the uh but on the brink but not further I would say right that the that there

is uh one suggestion uh which is not a any proof uh itself but it may suggest that they were preparing the operational use of this is that a base has has been discovered uh then it was uh uh

extreme northeastern end of the uh of Norway on the border with Russia if with Soviet Union then today it's uh uh it's on Russian territory territory uh the place is called Linnahamari and there are uh very interesting structures

out there I've heard of this place which look like um pods uh like you know uh

circular pod uh large structures like pods for for for missiles for rockets for large rockets but they uh they have they they are in the you know 100 feet diameter uh order of magnitude the the size I mean

it's uh it's very large and it's very mysterious because it doesn't fit any uh known uh uh picture of of any base you know but uh what is strange here is that uh it it has been built on

uh on a territory closest on a part of the the occup territory occupied by by the by the Germans closest to the United States effectively it's uh the you know the pretty much the north northernmost uh uh extremity

of uh of Norway uh and uh it it's it's very strange because it suggests that uh something that was you to use it was uh circular and very large the large the size of uh uh uh uh uh

one long bus for example or two buses the disorder of magnitude and uh perhaps because uh it was um the SS I I I I've heard that the the SS out was present out there during the war in

this construction construction effort so uh perhaps they were building a base already but uh I uh it's it's only an uh you know a suspicion I I I cannot prove it but it it looks strange it looks very

strange and it uh as in my mind i i I turn attention to this uh to this place because uh you know I I still remember the the something that Admiral Richard Byrd has mentioned in an interview for

uh Chilean I guess uh radio or newspaper during the Operation uh hij jump uh in nineteen forty seven he has mentioned that uh the the United States has to take seriously uh I mean uh I'm I'm saying it

from from memory I'm I'm not exact it's not an exact quotation that uh the United States has to uh really look at the at the possibility of the enemy uh whose uh flying crafts are able to to fly

from one uh pole to the other one. Yeah yeah so it's uh this base is quite quite close to the pole and uh that's why I I uh you know raised my interest.

What's the name of that place again, Igor? Linnahamari L I N N A H A M like Marta

I got it thank you I will look at that yeah like in Google Earth right now

what the hell happened here um before Eskimos and West there would be Google, right?

I'm just mentioning it it as a as something that maybe might be research worth researching in the in the future. Oh I think I think you're onto something Igor right every every intuition in my body tells me that that you're onto something you and I have been around this for far too long so that we know to trust

those and what really backs this up is the fact that the Germans kept two three hundred thousand soldiers in Norway all the way up to the very end where there's going to be them and we supposedly they yeah

supposedly they they were defending it very fiercely, you know which didn't make any sense from other point points of view because it was uh on the you know outskirts of the empire that that was collapsing already.

Igor is is this place anywhere close to Spitsbergen no it's quite far. Far from Spitsbergen all right it's it's quite far. Spitsbergen is uh is quite far from the from the you know shores of uh of of Norway yeah all right yeah I don't I don't remember exactly but you have to look well the reason the reason I'm asking

about Spitsbergen is again uh during the war the I know the turpit's went on that very strange mission to blast a British radio weather station into Smith which of course it did but you know I've always wondered why

are the Germans bothering to send a battleship to you know to take out a British weather station so I'm thinking maybe there was something more that you know the British were trying to listen in on on perhaps whatever

was going on. Who knows? I don't know but I just thought that very curious but yeah don't go on do you know no no you go on I I I'm sorry for saying this but uh I I just have to to quit uh

I I I have other things to do. Oh okay uh so maybe we will continue after some time and I think we have to make a we haven't talked about uh any of uh any of your new books

what uh what are you writing about now uh generally I'm writing about uh what is going on with our civilization our so that's kind of what I wanted three of us to to talk about you you can't uh

you can't hold for another half an hour about the nothing that's happening in the world today.

No I I I'm I can't I can't all right uh maybe another time maybe we will make a second round of I I think we should because it's not like there's nothing going on in the world these days.

Well it's uh you know uh I don't know know how to how to summari you know how how how to describe it but it's uh

nothing is going on only that this world is going to an end.

I mean I in in the shape that we know it's not that that it physically we cease to exist but uh it uh changes are coming. Yeah. We live in interesting times as we usually say.

Yeah so to say all right Igor well um sorry you have to run but we will catch you definitely do this again. With pleasure. Outstanding it's nice to meet you finally uh Igor and to talk thank you so much meet me too it was pleasure for me too so I I look forward to to to to continue but I uh just not

today. Okay I'll see you soon

right so uh yes well that was a mouthful

My name is Tino Struckman I run lost battlefields every year I travel around the world to try to bring you to all the most interesting historical military locations for modern wars and the World War II special projects battlefields

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