Melinda Leslie on MILABs — The Higherside Chats (2017-12-30)

Source: YouTube, The Higherside Chats (host Greg Carlwood) — "Melinda Leslie | Alien Abductions, Milabs, & Their Eerie Corporate Connections - The Higherside". URL: https://youtu.be/ZOvvzj7TTJw (1:21:36). Speaker: Melinda Leslie, self-described abductee and "MILAB"/"RE-AB" researcher (Sedona UFO-tour operator). Transcription: YouTube English auto-captions via youtube_transcript.py --timestamps (machine ASR; minor errors). Captured: 2026-06-07. Analysis: ../../sources/leslie-milab-experiencer.

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[00:00:00.000] Unless you really do. That's true, Dr.
[00:00:02.960] Sayers. There were. Where would we be
[00:00:06.480] without GAC?
[00:00:08.400] Cuz we know that liars to us just don't
[00:00:11.120] know know what to bring.
[00:00:12.800] Yeah, where would we be
[00:00:15.200] without GAC?
[00:00:17.400] The highest side chat show,
[00:00:20.360] Greg Carlwood
[00:00:22.040] company.
[00:00:23.440] All right, folks. We're no stranger to
[00:00:25.040] the ET abduction scenario as anybody
[00:00:27.280] with an interest can pour over countless
[00:00:29.040] cases stretching back decades and even
[00:00:30.960] centuries, but a lesser talked about
[00:00:33.040] phenomenon are the military abductions
[00:00:35.160] or milabs where shadow state and black
[00:00:37.280] ops groups follow up on genuine ET
[00:00:39.320] experiences with their own simulated
[00:00:41.360] abductions and interrogations. And
[00:00:43.640] shining a spotlight on this slice of the
[00:00:45.360] pie can be even more insightful when we
[00:00:47.200] try to get a grip on the big picture
[00:00:49.080] because we get indications of who knows
[00:00:50.880] what, who's working with who, and what
[00:00:53.000] the deeper motivations might be behind
[00:00:54.760] all this high strangeness. Well, today's
[00:00:57.000] guest Melinda Leslie is just the person
[00:00:58.960] to talk to because not only has she had
[00:01:00.800] her own lifelong string of occasional
[00:01:02.920] encounters with these beings and of
[00:01:04.600] course about eight milab follow-ups that
[00:01:06.680] she can recall, she's also interviewed
[00:01:08.880] over a hundred fellow experiencers and
[00:01:10.880] as a result has a pretty well educated
[00:01:13.000] opinion on some of the major
[00:01:14.200] commonalities and possible agendas. But
[00:01:16.840] that's not all, folks. She also leads
[00:01:18.520] night vision goggle clad UFO tours in
[00:01:21.080] the desert of Arizona with a near
[00:01:22.920] perfect sighting record as well as being
[00:01:25.280] a medium and psychic who specializes in
[00:01:27.520] connecting with one's spirit guides.
[00:01:29.440] You've seen her on TV and conferences
[00:01:31.120] around the country as well as heard her
[00:01:32.680] on Coast to Coast and all the other
[00:01:34.120] major hubs of weird and it's an honor to
[00:01:36.000] have her here today. Melinda Leslie,
[00:01:37.640] welcome to the higher side.
[00:01:39.680] Thank you, Greg. Thank you for having
[00:01:40.920] me.
[00:01:41.680] Well, thanks so much for being here.
[00:01:43.000] This is really exciting. As you know, I
[00:01:44.920] recently had Robert Guffey on to talk
[00:01:46.960] about his book Cameleo which details a
[00:01:48.880] case of military gang stalking and
[00:01:50.760] electronic harassment here in San Diego.
[00:01:53.320] And as we got deeper into things like
[00:01:55.240] milab experiences and eerie corporate
[00:01:57.680] connections here in town, your name came
[00:02:00.080] up as the real go-to person to find out
[00:02:02.040] more. So, this is a real treat for me.
[00:02:04.240] But, to start this off, I've heard MILAB
[00:02:06.360] experiences described in a couple of
[00:02:08.520] different ways. That the shadow state is
[00:02:10.640] doing all this to try to play catch-up
[00:02:12.520] and investigate the genuine abduction
[00:02:14.400] phenomenon, that the UFO experiences of
[00:02:17.680] the past few decades were just a cover,
[00:02:19.959] and that it's been military the whole
[00:02:21.360] time. And of course, the third option,
[00:02:23.800] that they're working together. So, to
[00:02:25.840] clarify, give us a better idea of how
[00:02:27.840] you define the MILAB experience.
[00:02:30.959] Well, first off, I'll let people know I
[00:02:32.880] don't like that term. Right. I did know
[00:02:35.360] that. And the reason is I think it's
[00:02:37.080] extremely limiting. It leads one to
[00:02:40.360] think that it is all military, or that
[00:02:43.480] the only people involved in this are
[00:02:45.280] military. And so, it really falls short
[00:02:48.000] from even coming close to describing it.
[00:02:51.360] It's any covert human organization
[00:02:55.360] involved in the
[00:02:58.120] uh
[00:02:59.080] in the abduct alien abduction scenario.
[00:03:01.959] And it's also come to mean things that
[00:03:03.720] have stuff going on that has no
[00:03:06.360] relationship to alien abduction. In my
[00:03:08.760] research, I focus on people who've had
[00:03:12.360] alien or extraterrestrial abductions who
[00:03:14.280] then get targeted by covert human
[00:03:16.760] agencies. Now, sometimes these agencies
[00:03:19.959] are military, as far as they have
[00:03:21.920] military uniforms and their uh military
[00:03:24.600] bases and etc. And military equipment.
[00:03:28.840] And sometimes they seem to be more like
[00:03:32.200] covert human organizations like
[00:03:33.840] intelligence organizations and offshoots
[00:03:37.239] of that. I mean, that's not just one
[00:03:39.840] body. That's it's like a huge octopus
[00:03:42.920] with multiple arms. So, there can be
[00:03:44.840] multiple
[00:03:46.600] branches and groups within groups and
[00:03:48.840] that kind of thing. And it's extremely
[00:03:50.360] compartmentalized.
[00:03:52.080] And you can be having involvement with
[00:03:54.200] more than one group or more than one
[00:03:56.560] aspect of that at one time. And again,
[00:03:59.000] on my research, I I I choose to limit it
[00:04:02.160] to
[00:04:03.520] cuz otherwise it gets just too big, too
[00:04:05.400] broad, too much into various mind
[00:04:08.120] control subjects and whatnot. And that's
[00:04:10.480] all well and good and certainly I come
[00:04:12.200] across
[00:04:13.440] search, but I really choose for mine to
[00:04:16.359] have a very specific focus of people
[00:04:18.320] who've had alien abduction or you know,
[00:04:20.880] extraterrestrial abduction who then get
[00:04:22.840] targeted.
[00:04:23.560] Mhm. And uh and it's because they're
[00:04:25.760] very real abductees. Now, with what
[00:04:28.440] you're just saying where
[00:04:30.480] oh, some people say it's all military.
[00:04:31.880] Well, that rules out all the experiences
[00:04:34.200] where people are seeing military and ETs
[00:04:36.600] combined. Right. And I think one of the
[00:04:40.200] other things you said is it's all
[00:04:42.919] one of the theories is that they're
[00:04:44.160] investigating it. Well, no. Mhm.
[00:04:48.000] No, no, they're they're working with
[00:04:49.480] them and they're actually um
[00:04:52.040] a whole bunch of things are going on,
[00:04:53.440] but one of the things
[00:04:55.840] kind of like down the road in the
[00:04:57.880] experiences,
[00:04:59.440] if you start to have this, it starts one
[00:05:01.520] way
[00:05:02.520] and kind of ramps up. I actually in my
[00:05:04.840] presentations, I show this diagram I
[00:05:07.160] made of like a curve, you know, going
[00:05:09.280] along and then, you know, like a kind of
[00:05:11.160] like a bar chart, you know, but a curved
[00:05:12.800] line going up and I say it starts like
[00:05:14.960] this and then it escalates, escalates,
[00:05:17.160] escalates and at any point you can
[00:05:19.040] repeat any portion of that. But the the
[00:05:22.800] thing I have it escalating to
[00:05:25.880] way down the road is people being
[00:05:28.200] recruited into these programs to
[00:05:31.240] participate themselves.
[00:05:33.240] And there's a whole string of programs
[00:05:34.960] that people get get recruited in.
[00:05:36.960] Everything from things that fall under
[00:05:38.600] the category of secret space program
[00:05:41.560] to things that fall under the category
[00:05:43.400] of mind control to things that fall into
[00:05:45.680] the categories of time travel programs
[00:05:48.720] and of course the sci paranormal
[00:05:51.040] programs. You know, and and those are
[00:05:53.160] just some of them, you know, so you
[00:05:55.360] fit into any one of those programs. Oh,
[00:05:57.160] and another one would be ET
[00:05:58.400] communication programs where you're used
[00:06:00.920] as a communicator with the ETs. And then
[00:06:02.840] another program might be
[00:06:05.120] to become a perpetrator of the mylabs.
[00:06:07.560] And so some of the guys who are doing
[00:06:09.400] mylabs started off as abductees and got
[00:06:12.520] recruited. Mhm. Often those people then
[00:06:15.960] at some point had a military or
[00:06:18.400] intelligence background. So that
[00:06:20.720] combined with being the abductee, you
[00:06:23.120] know, and and that's just it. Your
[00:06:25.480] chances of having
[00:06:28.720] the mylab stuff goes up exponentially
[00:06:31.680] depending on your background, your
[00:06:33.800] family's background and a variety of
[00:06:35.560] things.
[00:06:36.040] Right. As we know alien abductions runs
[00:06:38.800] in families. That has been long proven
[00:06:41.480] in abduction research that if you're an
[00:06:44.640] abductee, you find it happened to your
[00:06:46.160] parents, you have kids, it happens to
[00:06:47.680] them. I mean three generations is common
[00:06:50.680] like almost all abductees realize that
[00:06:52.520] there's a third generation thing. Um
[00:06:54.800] now it for a long time there's been a
[00:06:56.800] lot of fourth generations. Now we're
[00:06:58.360] even starting to see fifth generation.
[00:07:00.760] So we realize that this goes back in
[00:07:03.680] families and and then as an abductee
[00:07:06.919] when you have kids it goes forward in
[00:07:08.400] your family, you know. So um
[00:07:11.240] and we know that. Well, it's it's also
[00:07:13.000] true with the mylab experience. It often
[00:07:16.000] runs in families as well. Mhm. Much for
[00:07:18.480] the same reason. If they're following
[00:07:20.040] you as an abductee, they may have
[00:07:22.160] followed your parents. The reason you're
[00:07:23.720] probably being targeted is your parents
[00:07:26.320] already had involvement and there starts
[00:07:28.440] to be these patterns like
[00:07:30.840] uh people's parents were maybe in a in
[00:07:34.520] intelligence in some way. In not just
[00:07:37.720] military cuz you know,
[00:07:39.520] people
[00:07:40.360] probably your age and my age and you
[00:07:42.600] know, or certainly anyone who's
[00:07:46.200] maybe 30 and older, or certainly 50 and
[00:07:48.520] older for certain, is going to have
[00:07:50.720] parents that were probably in the
[00:07:52.320] military, at least the father that was.
[00:07:54.280] And that's because of World War II or
[00:07:56.040] Vietnam, and you know, it's just it's
[00:07:57.920] just so prevalent. But so military loan
[00:08:00.720] doesn't necessarily mean anything, but
[00:08:02.000] if they were higher-level military, if
[00:08:04.560] they were officer, um um
[00:08:07.600] if a parent or a or a close relative was
[00:08:12.160] in the intelligence community,
[00:08:14.360] was in the aerospace community, again
[00:08:17.080] particularly if they're higher-level,
[00:08:19.360] um if they were deep into secret society
[00:08:22.600] stuff,
[00:08:23.760] um so these are the things that start to
[00:08:25.640] add up, and a lot of these My Lab cases
[00:08:28.280] go ding ding ding on multiple
[00:08:29.760] combinations of that. Right. And and it
[00:08:32.360] could be, you know, because of your
[00:08:33.960] because of that parent or that
[00:08:35.440] grandparent is why they watch for what
[00:08:39.200] are the what was going to happen to the
[00:08:41.039] kids, you know?
[00:08:42.560] And if you end up being extremely
[00:08:45.160] intelligent,
[00:08:46.880] if you end up being extremely, you know,
[00:08:49.320] psychic or have paranormal abilities, if
[00:08:52.320] you end up being an alien abductee, you
[00:08:55.000] could get targeted and recruited, and
[00:08:57.280] often that's that's the same
[00:08:59.360] series of events that happens for people
[00:09:01.440] who get put taken into a mind control
[00:09:03.520] program. Even if it has seemingly
[00:09:05.480] nothing to do with anything
[00:09:07.200] extraterrestrial, it seems to be that
[00:09:09.680] it's recruited, and again it runs in
[00:09:11.440] families. Well, same with this. It's
[00:09:13.400] kind of like they're using the same
[00:09:15.800] I don't know what I'm trying to say.
[00:09:17.080] Template, yeah. The same Yeah, perfect
[00:09:19.040] word. Perfect word. A lot of words were
[00:09:21.160] starting to come up, but that's the
[00:09:22.200] perfect word. The same template or
[00:09:24.600] template for for finding these
[00:09:26.600] individuals and using them, etc. etc.
[00:09:29.240] Now, a lot of times some abductees just
[00:09:32.200] have really low-grade
[00:09:35.120] harassment surveillance stuff. Yes. And
[00:09:38.000] it kind of and it can stop. In other
[00:09:39.600] words, there may be where they start to
[00:09:41.440] kind of monitor you, like, are we
[00:09:43.160] interested in this person?
[00:09:45.160] Do they know enough about their
[00:09:46.560] experience, you know, or do they have
[00:09:48.520] the things we're looking for?
[00:09:51.040] And if not, then that can kind of happen
[00:09:53.920] and then it kind of dies off. So, I know
[00:09:55.440] a lot of abductees who had a certain
[00:09:57.720] amount of stuff and then that it just
[00:09:59.320] ends there. But like I said, then it can
[00:10:01.360] ramp up to the next thing and the next
[00:10:03.080] thing and the next thing and before you
[00:10:05.000] know it, you're going up this curve
[00:10:07.120] where you end up in
[00:10:09.440] a psi program, alien communication
[00:10:12.200] program, the secret space program, you
[00:10:14.600] know. Right, right.
[00:10:15.880] that far. Or you become a perpetrator. I
[00:10:18.000] mean, to me, I've met a woman who's a
[00:10:19.720] perpetrator. I'm sure they must exist,
[00:10:21.600] but so far I've met a few guys and in
[00:10:24.920] every case they started out being alien
[00:10:27.120] abductees.
[00:10:28.360] Well, if you can't beat them, join them,
[00:10:29.760] you know. Well, no.
[00:10:31.960] Well, I can tell you this.
[00:10:33.680] The usual case
[00:10:35.880] is that it is against their will. The
[00:10:38.200] usual case is it's in still like an
[00:10:40.800] abduction related scenario. They're
[00:10:42.400] under mind control. It's not something
[00:10:44.839] they made a choice to participate in.
[00:10:47.560] And with a few of them, yes, they made a
[00:10:50.800] choice and and it usually became because
[00:10:53.560] they were recruited into
[00:10:56.200] secret operations, often military
[00:10:59.640] related or intelligence related, usually
[00:11:02.400] out of the military. So, those guys that
[00:11:04.680] were in the military or in the
[00:11:06.720] intelligence community who then
[00:11:09.640] get recruited, but also happen to be
[00:11:12.080] alien abductees. Some of them, it's it's
[00:11:15.120] a choice in their participation. But
[00:11:17.520] I've met guys that it is done in an
[00:11:20.240] altered state, under drugged or hypnosis
[00:11:22.880] or so it's seemingly the same kind of
[00:11:25.160] event like an abduction event, except
[00:11:27.200] for they're used used as a perpetrator.
[00:11:29.280] And that's really really unfortunate.
[00:11:31.080] So,
[00:11:32.400] I think they want your cooperation, but
[00:11:34.400] they're going to use you whether they
[00:11:35.600] get it or not, maybe. Right.
[00:11:37.680] Unfortunately, you know. And I mean, I
[00:11:39.160] know this sounds pretty dark, but it can
[00:11:41.360] be. And I've
[00:11:43.280] unfortunately come across all this to
[00:11:44.920] go, "Okay, I You know, that's where I
[00:11:46.640] started to come up with this
[00:11:48.640] pattern of this, you know, ramping up in
[00:11:50.600] someone's life." And And it can start
[00:11:52.720] really low grade. And And interestingly
[00:11:54.600] enough, you know, even on my timeline, I
[00:11:57.240] don't have that it starts
[00:11:59.120] with the alien abduction.
[00:12:01.400] You know, on this line, I have a couple
[00:12:03.160] things before that on the timeline, if
[00:12:06.000] you will, of how it can ramp up. For
[00:12:08.080] instance,
[00:12:09.560] what makes you an alien abductee can go
[00:12:11.600] back in your family, as we just said.
[00:12:13.480] So, it can be family involvement in any
[00:12:17.120] of those programs that I mentioned. It
[00:12:19.160] can be And like I said, then the secret
[00:12:21.640] society stuff. It can also be uh uh
[00:12:24.440] involved in the aerospace engineering
[00:12:27.080] program or or NASA or in you know, or or
[00:12:30.120] the intelligence community or high-level
[00:12:31.840] military or any combination thereof, you
[00:12:33.960] know. But as those things go back, so
[00:12:37.160] that can all exist long before you ever
[00:12:39.400] realize or even have an alien abduction.
[00:12:42.839] And of course, alien abductions
[00:12:44.280] themselves can go back in your family.
[00:12:47.120] And And then there's a historical
[00:12:49.360] pattern going back even into not to make
[00:12:53.280] a
[00:12:53.839] cheap connection here, but I I mean this
[00:12:55.880] very seriously cuz they've actually
[00:12:57.600] addressed it on the show Ancient Aliens,
[00:13:00.680] where they've not only Well, of course,
[00:13:02.600] it's all about the historical
[00:13:03.680] connection, but they've even gotten back
[00:13:05.640] to
[00:13:06.680] the elite and those in power and those
[00:13:08.960] in military and those in intelligence
[00:13:10.440] going back in history were involved in
[00:13:13.160] this. You know, they've addressed that a
[00:13:14.720] couple times, you go, "Okay, this goes
[00:13:16.320] way back."
[00:13:17.800] But for the individual, it can go back
[00:13:20.160] in your family,
[00:13:22.880] not only just the alien abduction, of
[00:13:24.680] course, that can, but also these other
[00:13:26.840] things, these other areas of
[00:13:29.720] And so all that can preexist and then
[00:13:31.800] even as an abductee often
[00:13:34.800] you start to have
[00:13:36.760] some kind of communication with ETs
[00:13:39.440] before you have a physical abduction.
[00:13:41.880] Now, lot most abductees it starts in
[00:13:43.800] childhood.
[00:13:45.120] So it's real hard to pinpoint that, but
[00:13:46.960] in a few cases where maybe it started a
[00:13:48.960] little later in life, there was some
[00:13:51.080] involvement. It's very common for an
[00:13:53.440] abductee or at least that involvement is
[00:13:56.520] what causes you to then realize you've
[00:13:58.920] had this all along. Like with me, I
[00:14:01.200] didn't find out I had alien abductions
[00:14:03.720] till 1989, but it turned out I had had
[00:14:06.520] them my whole life. Mhm. And it turns
[00:14:09.200] out once I start doing all this
[00:14:11.360] research, of course my own dad and my
[00:14:13.760] own family I start checking off those
[00:14:15.840] things that I was coming up for other
[00:14:17.720] people. And I just start going, well, do
[00:14:19.680] I have that? Oh, yeah, I do.
[00:14:22.360] Pardon my language, but
[00:14:23.200] No, no worries. Uh one thing that's
[00:14:25.200] interesting about the internet is like
[00:14:26.640] cable TV and stuff. Absolutely.
[00:14:28.400] Absolutely. We are like HBO here. Say
[00:14:30.360] whatever the hell you need to say.
[00:14:32.000] What's interesting about the family
[00:14:34.240] lines thing is that so many of us who
[00:14:36.920] are involved in it or just, you know,
[00:14:38.720] are enthusiasts in it, a lot of people
[00:14:40.760] want some kind of verification uh that
[00:14:42.960] these things happen. And since we know
[00:14:45.080] the exact families that are being taken,
[00:14:47.240] it seems like we should be able to
[00:14:49.480] monitor those people and catch them in
[00:14:51.080] the act in in some regard. Has that ever
[00:14:54.000] been attempted?
[00:14:55.640] No, we're not that far down the road.
[00:14:59.160] There's a lot of things even in alien
[00:15:01.320] abduction research. There's so much can
[00:15:03.040] be done and I I
[00:15:05.080] I used to joke with Bud and John Mack
[00:15:08.240] and Dave and stuff. Dave's still alive,
[00:15:09.800] but the other two are past
[00:15:10.960] unfortunately.
[00:15:12.080] And I involved very much with Yvonne
[00:15:14.280] Smith and Barbara Lamb and you know
[00:15:16.880] etc. etc.
[00:15:18.440] Kathleen Martin and
[00:15:20.000] and but
[00:15:21.520] um
[00:15:23.200] there's kind of this thing like it's
[00:15:24.800] it's we're so caught up in triage. It's
[00:15:27.440] all about
[00:15:28.920] helping the traumatized abductee figure
[00:15:31.320] out is this really going on, what's
[00:15:32.720] going on, you know, is there physical
[00:15:35.120] evidence, and helping them come to terms
[00:15:37.280] with it, and getting them in some kind
[00:15:38.520] of support.
[00:15:39.320] Mhm. But, that's
[00:15:41.120] where it keeps just cycling through. I
[00:15:43.400] agree.
[00:15:43.920] beyond that in the research because it's
[00:15:46.600] so much about trying to help that person
[00:15:48.760] and help that person integrate it into
[00:15:50.840] their
[00:15:51.600] life and live with it and feel supported
[00:15:53.720] and feel whole and feel he- healed that
[00:15:56.480] it's we're we're just we're always in
[00:15:57.960] triage.
[00:15:58.600] Yeah. And so, to do
[00:16:01.240] a lot of the research that could be done
[00:16:03.560] on it, it's very tough. Now,
[00:16:05.640] occasionally, just when things start to
[00:16:08.320] get motivated to kind of maybe do that
[00:16:10.520] research,
[00:16:12.320] somebody fall- you know, somebody passes
[00:16:14.160] away, someone has something other
[00:16:17.000] traumatic happen in their life, and you
[00:16:18.640] know, I mean, like a researcher passes
[00:16:20.320] like passes away, or someone has trauma
[00:16:23.080] or something, you know, in their own
[00:16:24.240] personal life unrelated, and they're
[00:16:26.240] caught up doing that or whatever. So,
[00:16:28.320] like, you can think of like the MIT
[00:16:30.839] study that happened years ago. Wow,
[00:16:33.120] we're starting to make some real headway
[00:16:34.600] and get some real information, some real
[00:16:36.240] research, and then it's dead in the
[00:16:37.880] water, you know. Right. And just for a
[00:16:40.720] million reasons. Occasionally, there's
[00:16:43.520] things even now where organizations are
[00:16:46.000] trying to say let's take this to the
[00:16:47.600] next level and do some more research and
[00:16:50.200] get some more data. And one of the
[00:16:52.000] organizations doing that that I'm very
[00:16:54.160] proud to be a part of- I'm not on their
[00:16:56.400] primary board. I'm kind of just a
[00:16:57.880] consultant to them, but I really support
[00:17:00.080] what they do is called FREE, F R E E,
[00:17:03.040] which is the Dr. Edgar Mitchell
[00:17:05.760] Foundation for research into extra- the
[00:17:08.640] tongue-tied- into extra-
[00:17:10.319] extraterrestrial encounters. There we
[00:17:12.560] go.
[00:17:13.240] But, the And of course, uh
[00:17:15.199] Dr. Edgar Mitchell was one of the the
[00:17:17.120] founders and on the board of it until
[00:17:19.240] his unfortunately, you know, recent
[00:17:21.079] passing. But um
[00:17:23.480] uh but he he he was involved in it and
[00:17:27.800] uh kind of the managing director, kind
[00:17:30.480] of managing the business of it is a guy
[00:17:32.360] named Ray Hernandez. And then it has I
[00:17:34.720] mentioned Kathleen Marden and and it has
[00:17:37.360] a whole she's on the board but a whole
[00:17:38.960] list of scientists and some physicists
[00:17:41.760] even on the board. So it's it's trying
[00:17:44.120] to really come about it from a very kind
[00:17:47.120] of a pragmatic grounded yet they're all
[00:17:49.240] people who are also involved in
[00:17:50.600] consciousness study and research. And so
[00:17:53.600] they're also looking at it from the
[00:17:55.280] consciousness angle and from a spiritual
[00:17:57.480] angle. And that's really nice that there
[00:18:00.040] it's like they're no stone unturned, you
[00:18:02.360] know, they're they're willing to
[00:18:03.440] consider all the angles, all the aspects
[00:18:06.160] because of how complicated it is.
[00:18:08.800] And they're starting off with doing
[00:18:10.480] these surveys that people can go online
[00:18:13.600] and take these surveys that help you
[00:18:15.320] both determine how much you're having
[00:18:17.280] happen and if you're an abductee or a
[00:18:19.200] contactee. And then it goes and then
[00:18:22.120] they the surveys get more involved. Now
[00:18:24.360] they had me put together a complete my
[00:18:27.200] lab-related survey for them, covert
[00:18:29.000] involvement survey. Uh it's a whole
[00:18:30.680] series of questions. That's kind of on
[00:18:32.960] hold because they're still getting the
[00:18:34.760] results and and trying to do the science
[00:18:37.240] and the statistics on the initial
[00:18:38.800] surveys. But they tell me down the road
[00:18:41.680] they do want to use that. Now even in
[00:18:43.880] their second survey
[00:18:45.680] I I lab-related questions. But kind of
[00:18:47.920] what spurred me on to really work with
[00:18:49.720] them as I thought I mean I I I'm glad
[00:18:52.280] that they asked anything. And that they
[00:18:53.760] thought to include anything is
[00:18:55.000] wonderful. But they asked the wrong
[00:18:57.080] questions. So they're getting a very
[00:18:59.000] small percentage because the questions
[00:19:00.800] weren't the right questions. It was
[00:19:02.200] like, have you been abducted by the
[00:19:03.960] military? Well, okay, that's limiting it
[00:19:06.240] to military and it's limiting it to only
[00:19:07.880] the times where you're physically
[00:19:09.400] removed by humans, you know. Right,
[00:19:11.800] right. And and it's like, no, wait,
[00:19:14.160] wait. They didn't even ask the question,
[00:19:16.440] have you been abducted by ETs and seen
[00:19:19.480] humans in military outfits or people in
[00:19:22.080] lab attire or people in suits present in
[00:19:25.160] the in in the scene, you know? Right,
[00:19:27.520] right. You got to be very careful with
[00:19:29.000] your wording. Yeah, exactly. So,
[00:19:32.000] even with that though, I think they said
[00:19:35.000] they were getting about a 10 or 12%
[00:19:37.120] return from all and and and and that's
[00:19:39.200] out of thousands of people taking this
[00:19:40.720] thing. So, that's still pretty high
[00:19:42.600] numbers. Now, that's not the only
[00:19:43.840] question they asked, but all the
[00:19:45.400] questions were kind of predicated on
[00:19:47.120] that idea. And and so,
[00:19:50.400] you know, so even then, they're getting,
[00:19:52.600] you know, 10 12% response, which
[00:19:55.480] is is pretty high Oh, yeah. out of
[00:19:57.880] abductees. And when they start asking
[00:19:59.760] the right questions, I highly suspect
[00:20:03.920] it'll be at least a 40% response. Wow.
[00:20:07.640] be as high as 60%. Mhm.
[00:20:10.720] when they ask the right questions. It
[00:20:12.800] with some of the other related
[00:20:14.040] questions. So, that's why I developed
[00:20:15.760] that for them and I look really forward
[00:20:17.760] to when they start using that and have
[00:20:20.600] it be a place where we can really get
[00:20:22.200] some real numbers on this.
[00:20:24.000] Yeah.
[00:20:24.560] how much it's really involved. That will
[00:20:26.480] be nice. So, another aspect I'm
[00:20:28.800] interested in is I've heard you talk
[00:20:30.200] about this pattern of equations or
[00:20:32.680] advanced math or formulas being
[00:20:34.600] communicated or shown to abductees, and
[00:20:37.280] that's really interesting cuz that also
[00:20:38.800] comes up in other areas of strange
[00:20:40.960] contact like beings encountered on
[00:20:42.880] psychedelics. Can you elaborate on that
[00:20:45.440] angle at all? This is what the Milabs
[00:20:47.560] groups are after in at least some cases,
[00:20:49.480] right? Yes, yeah. Yeah, good question.
[00:20:52.400] In some cases, yeah. I'll say this, in
[00:20:54.680] in my research, I kind of have it in
[00:20:57.400] five
[00:20:58.720] I have to do this off top of my head cuz
[00:20:59.800] I mean, I don't have any notes in front
[00:21:01.200] of me. So, you guys, this is all just
[00:21:03.160] I've just done this for so long, it's in
[00:21:05.280] the brain.
[00:21:06.360] Mhm. So, I have to
[00:21:08.080] go through that file, you know, rifle
[00:21:09.640] through the files, pull that one out.
[00:21:11.000] Okay, there we go. Um okay, there's five
[00:21:14.760] uh major things that they're interested
[00:21:17.120] in from the abductees.
[00:21:19.520] One is alien agenda and motives.
[00:21:22.640] So, like, what do you know about the
[00:21:24.400] alien agenda? What do you know about
[00:21:25.840] their motives? What are they really
[00:21:27.320] doing? Um why are they producing the
[00:21:30.280] hybrids to the degree that they are? And
[00:21:32.160] we'll get it more into that if you want.
[00:21:33.800] Um
[00:21:34.600] why are they picking you up? Do you know
[00:21:36.720] why they're involved with you? Do you
[00:21:38.720] know why they might be involved with
[00:21:40.280] your family?
[00:21:41.640] Um
[00:21:42.240] have they told you what their agenda is
[00:21:44.240] or their motives? And so, that's
[00:21:45.760] category one.
[00:21:47.360] Category two is is psi ability. They're
[00:21:50.840] looking for the psi ability in the
[00:21:52.280] abductee. Psi being, of course, the
[00:21:53.840] psychic, the paranormal abilities. Do
[00:21:56.000] you do remote viewing? Do you do
[00:21:57.520] psychokinesis? Do you do telepathy? You
[00:22:00.800] know, etc. etc.
[00:22:02.520] So, those kinds of things, you know,
[00:22:04.200] they're and then they'll test you in
[00:22:06.120] those abilities and try to determine
[00:22:07.680] what you have.
[00:22:08.960] And how much have you learned that from
[00:22:11.360] the ETs? Has it been enhanced by the
[00:22:13.880] ETs?
[00:22:15.080] Which gets us also to the next category,
[00:22:17.840] which is genetics.
[00:22:20.000] So, why are they interested in you
[00:22:21.960] genetically? Is there something
[00:22:23.160] different about your genetics? Have you
[00:22:25.120] been altered? Are you a hybrid to
[00:22:27.720] whatever degree, you know, little or a
[00:22:29.480] lot or anything in between? Have you
[00:22:31.560] been affected and changed genetically
[00:22:34.160] and or is there something different
[00:22:36.240] about your genetics? That kind of thing.
[00:22:39.400] And the And all these things
[00:22:40.560] cross-correlate, you can see, cuz as I
[00:22:42.360] just took that out, the psi thing,
[00:22:43.920] there's a genetic component to the psi
[00:22:46.160] part, and then there's a genetic genetic
[00:22:48.320] component, obviously, to
[00:22:49.880] the alien agenda and motives. So, you
[00:22:51.240] know, all these things is it's very hard
[00:22:52.800] to separate them cuz they're all
[00:22:53.880] intertwined. But, okay, so the first
[00:22:56.240] being agenda motives, the second being
[00:22:58.200] your psi abilities, the third being your
[00:22:59.880] genetics or
[00:23:01.520] anything different about you
[00:23:02.520] genetically.
[00:23:03.880] And if it's happening to your kids, why
[00:23:05.280] them too, blah blah blah. Okay. And then
[00:23:07.520] the next would be mind control and and
[00:23:11.080] I'm going to put the one you brought up
[00:23:12.320] last, but these aren't in any particular
[00:23:13.920] order. If anything, I would say the
[00:23:15.160] technology one might be second after
[00:23:17.400] alien agenda and motives.
[00:23:19.120] But so you know, I'm these this order
[00:23:20.760] doesn't mean anything. These are all
[00:23:22.000] equal in in significance to them. But
[00:23:24.440] the next being mind control. How much of
[00:23:27.280] you controlled or influenced by the
[00:23:29.080] aliens?
[00:23:30.120] And and what can we practice or learn
[00:23:32.560] from your mind control? And and can we
[00:23:36.120] develop our mind control? I mean we
[00:23:37.960] mean, you know, the the covert guys.
[00:23:40.520] You know, can they develop the mind
[00:23:42.920] control techniques and abilities and
[00:23:44.560] stuff so you become a useful target
[00:23:47.000] guinea pig and all that stuff.
[00:23:48.400] Mhm. And so that's where there's so much
[00:23:49.840] bleed over into those areas. And then of
[00:23:51.960] course, then last but not least, the
[00:23:53.160] fifth one, which might actually be
[00:23:55.440] second really in importance, is
[00:23:58.160] technology. Mhm.
[00:23:59.520] So it gets into a bunch of different
[00:24:01.320] aspects of technology. Have you been
[00:24:03.120] shown technology by ETs? Have you been
[00:24:05.880] shown navigation systems, propulsion
[00:24:08.720] systems, weapon systems,
[00:24:10.880] structural architectural systems? Have
[00:24:13.360] you been shown alien languages? And this
[00:24:16.280] gets into the formula things. Now alien
[00:24:18.280] math, formulas, alien science, you know.
[00:24:21.880] So how much technology information have
[00:24:24.120] they given you like that? And uh
[00:24:27.480] and really uh
[00:24:29.040] next to agenda and motives, I think this
[00:24:31.440] is the thing that they seem to be most
[00:24:33.560] interested in. Right.
[00:24:35.080] And in my case, now maybe I'm a little
[00:24:36.640] bit jaded because in my own experience,
[00:24:38.880] that's what they wanted, you know. And
[00:24:40.840] some of the other things too, but that
[00:24:42.160] was you know, predominantly. Are there
[00:24:44.160] any other details you can give us about
[00:24:45.840] the technology that people are shown in
[00:24:47.440] these experiences?
[00:24:49.120] In the in alien abductions? Right. All
[00:24:52.000] sorts of stuff. Oh gosh, all sorts of
[00:24:54.880] for instance, you mentioned formulas and
[00:24:56.520] stuff. So, formulas, equations,
[00:24:59.320] math. Some of these get very complex.
[00:25:02.040] Rarely does the abductee really
[00:25:03.720] understand anything that they're being
[00:25:05.600] shown. Mhm. And this could be done where
[00:25:08.120] they where they're downloading this
[00:25:10.120] information and you start coming up with
[00:25:12.520] it in your in your dreams and and in
[00:25:15.120] your journaling, in your writing. I
[00:25:17.040] mean, I keep thinking as I'm talking
[00:25:18.920] about this, a very famous case for this
[00:25:21.480] involvement would be Stan Romanek, who
[00:25:25.320] would wake up in the morning and have
[00:25:26.880] his walls covered with these. He was
[00:25:29.200] writing them in the middle of night and
[00:25:30.360] had no idea he was doing it, you know,
[00:25:32.000] these formulas.
[00:25:33.360] Or on, you know, also on pieces of paper
[00:25:35.040] and stuff around, but on his on his
[00:25:36.920] door, on his walls, you know. Other
[00:25:39.040] people have done that, you know, or they
[00:25:40.520] suddenly will start writing them.
[00:25:42.520] Sometimes you remember that you were
[00:25:43.960] shown it in the experience and sometimes
[00:25:45.720] it's just like they're in your brain and
[00:25:47.160] you're not sure where it came from.
[00:25:49.760] Sometimes it's done in kind of like in
[00:25:51.600] Stan's case, almost like automatic
[00:25:53.800] writing kind of thing,
[00:25:54.920] Mhm.
[00:25:55.880] in an altered state or during the night
[00:25:58.600] or something. Sometimes this is just
[00:26:00.600] downloaded to your brain, sometimes
[00:26:02.040] you're shown on board. I mean, I was
[00:26:04.480] shown some symbols and stuff on a
[00:26:06.520] screen. Now, not a lot and I think it
[00:26:09.000] wasn't really necessary intended for me.
[00:26:10.960] I think the aliens were doing something,
[00:26:13.560] you know, communicating with each other
[00:26:14.960] and I just happened to see it in that
[00:26:17.120] particular case. Interesting. But but so
[00:26:19.960] that's it, you know, were you shown it
[00:26:21.320] on a screen? Did they have you draw it
[00:26:24.400] or do some things similar to work on a
[00:26:26.600] computer, typing or something?
[00:26:28.760] Or on a computer screen with your
[00:26:30.160] finger, you know. So, did they have you,
[00:26:32.440] you know, draw it or type it out in some
[00:26:34.160] way? And did they show or did they show
[00:26:36.160] it to you as some kind of 3D thing in
[00:26:38.000] the air? So, all these things happen.
[00:26:40.600] Mhm. And so and same with alien
[00:26:42.640] languages. So, first that was all about
[00:26:44.200] like math and symbols and that kind of
[00:26:45.960] stuff,
[00:26:46.960] which can be numbers, symbols, all sorts
[00:26:49.640] of stuff, and equations and sometimes
[00:26:52.120] they'll visually show you kind of like a
[00:26:55.080] science experiment or something, you
[00:26:56.560] know. And then like I said, languages,
[00:26:58.600] which can be letters or numbers,
[00:27:00.840] letters, words, you know, etc. etc.
[00:27:03.400] Sounds. Um and then some people get get
[00:27:06.720] shown um propulsion systems. Mhm.
[00:27:10.400] how the craft works or flies or what
[00:27:12.920] drives it or, you know, drive mechanic
[00:27:15.640] Yeah, tongue tied.
[00:27:17.160] drive mechanisms, propulsion systems,
[00:27:20.280] navigation systems. That's interesting.
[00:27:23.000] Sometimes it's shown to you like you're
[00:27:24.880] just being taught as if they're showing
[00:27:26.800] you a 3D thing or they're showing you an
[00:27:28.680] actual piece of equipment. And sometimes
[00:27:30.920] that abductee is sat at a control panel
[00:27:34.080] and they understand it's kind of a a
[00:27:35.800] mock-up situation. No, you didn't just
[00:27:37.480] crash the ship that, you know.
[00:27:39.440] It was like driver's training or say,
[00:27:40.600] you know.
[00:27:41.400] Oh, but some
[00:27:43.040] but sometimes the abductee knows I'm
[00:27:45.960] actually sat at real controls.
[00:27:48.320] And sometimes that's like a control
[00:27:50.160] panel with knobs or buttons and
[00:27:52.400] sometimes it's literally just a computer
[00:27:54.240] screen.
[00:27:55.320] Mhm.
[00:27:55.560] And everything in between. People get
[00:27:57.080] shown that.
[00:27:58.280] So, navigation systems, like I said,
[00:28:00.520] propulsion,
[00:28:02.120] other mechanical systems. I mean, one
[00:28:04.520] abductee says they went into all this
[00:28:06.960] detail of how the doors on the ships
[00:28:08.800] work.
[00:28:09.760] You know, like passageways and doors.
[00:28:12.880] I have no idea why they're showing all
[00:28:14.120] that to me, but
[00:28:15.640] you know, and I think too,
[00:28:17.760] if you're an abductee and you show
[00:28:20.520] First off, if you're
[00:28:22.240] the trick number one in abductions is
[00:28:25.080] learning to be conscious and present and
[00:28:27.960] not overcome by trauma or fear in the
[00:28:30.520] experience. And if you are extremely
[00:28:32.120] traumatic and fearful, they're going to
[00:28:33.800] shut you down. Yeah. And which is
[00:28:36.640] everything from paralyzation,
[00:28:38.440] immobilization to memory erasure, blah
[00:28:42.120] blah, etc. etc. So, you have to learn to
[00:28:44.840] to have control and be conscious in the
[00:28:48.160] experience. And it can be learned and
[00:28:50.840] many abductees do. And once you become
[00:28:53.960] present and conscious and free will in
[00:28:56.240] the experience where you have an an
[00:28:59.040] ability to interact, well, soon as you
[00:29:01.200] show interest in one of those things,
[00:29:03.000] like if they start to show you and
[00:29:05.000] you're asking questions and you're
[00:29:06.120] involved and you're interested in it,
[00:29:07.880] well, they're going to show you more.
[00:29:08.920] So, in her case, they might have shown
[00:29:10.280] her a door and she might have said,
[00:29:11.760] "How's that work?" And next thing
[00:29:13.600] she's in class on how the doors work.
[00:29:15.520] Mhm. You know, but I'm just saying, it
[00:29:17.120] it it could be like that, like showing
[00:29:18.720] interest. In my case, unfortunately, a
[00:29:21.760] lot of times I'm I'm out of it and I
[00:29:23.960] don't I'm not in the presence of mind or
[00:29:26.000] where I'm asking those things. But a few
[00:29:28.760] times I have or when they started to
[00:29:30.680] show me something and that's those those
[00:29:33.120] few times when I have been shown
[00:29:34.640] technology. I actually wish they would
[00:29:36.320] do that more.
[00:29:38.320] Yeah, of course.
[00:29:39.280] only been a handful of times. And some
[00:29:41.440] abductees get it quite heavily, but
[00:29:43.480] maybe it's because a lot of times I'm,
[00:29:46.080] you know, you're
[00:29:47.440] I mean, you're taking up you're usually
[00:29:48.920] taken under duress, against your will,
[00:29:52.080] in an altered state. There's an their
[00:29:55.000] it's initial reaction is to have fear or
[00:29:58.880] some amount of panic, even if you know
[00:30:00.720] it's going to be okay, just the high
[00:30:02.600] strangeness at the beginning, if you
[00:30:04.280] have the beginning.
[00:30:06.320] You know, and I think a lot of times
[00:30:08.120] they instantly kind of
[00:30:10.520] shut that down, so it's hard to get
[00:30:12.200] beyond that.
[00:30:13.040] Mhm. So, you know, it's it it's a it's a
[00:30:15.920] trick
[00:30:17.120] to learn and a few times I feel like
[00:30:19.560] I've been able to remain fairly
[00:30:21.680] conscious and interactive and other
[00:30:23.000] times
[00:30:24.520] not at all.
[00:30:25.800] And then there's the times where
[00:30:27.840] I didn't remember darn thing without I
[00:30:29.680] mean, it's some
[00:30:31.280] People say, "Well, do you need a
[00:30:32.040] regression or do you remember
[00:30:33.080] consciously?" It's not like that. You
[00:30:35.200] know, yeah, there's experiences I
[00:30:36.440] remember completely consciously and
[00:30:37.720] there's experiences I remember only with
[00:30:39.360] regression and there's a lot of
[00:30:40.920] experiences maybe I remember
[00:30:42.840] of it consciously and then I get
[00:30:44.040] regression to fill in the details. Mhm.
[00:30:47.200] But, you know, those ones that are fully
[00:30:49.240] conscious and I remember versus the ones
[00:30:51.280] that bought a regression to get through
[00:30:53.400] and I don't know why it was so blocked
[00:30:55.040] and then is that is that me that's
[00:30:57.200] imposing that or is that them that's
[00:30:59.800] imposing that and we still don't know
[00:31:01.960] those answers.
[00:31:03.840] I think a lot of it is self-imposed. I
[00:31:05.840] think when a person gets in fear cuz
[00:31:07.720] it's we know this. I mean, this is this
[00:31:09.600] is a known thing in in psychology with
[00:31:13.320] people who've had traumatic experiences
[00:31:15.200] in their life. You're you're in a plane
[00:31:17.000] crash, you block it out. Mhm.
[00:31:19.520] you'll remember very few details. It's
[00:31:21.280] just you know, there's a tendency for
[00:31:23.520] the brain to shut off that area like you
[00:31:26.320] know, like healing a wound or scar, it
[00:31:28.320] shuts it off, walls it off in the brain
[00:31:30.640] I think because otherwise, when you do
[00:31:33.640] have those memories,
[00:31:35.920] you have severe post-traumatic stress
[00:31:38.240] and all sorts of trauma and stuff in
[00:31:39.560] your life that can lead to a million and
[00:31:41.880] one problems, you know.
[00:31:43.360] Yeah, it's a defense mechanism.
[00:31:45.200] Psychological problems, drug, alcohol,
[00:31:47.920] you know, medical problems, mental
[00:31:49.200] problems, you name it. So, I think
[00:31:51.320] there's a tendency for we know that
[00:31:53.760] anyways
[00:31:55.120] that the human mind does that. So, of
[00:31:57.080] course, it makes perfect sense that with
[00:31:59.360] this traumatic experience it would do
[00:32:00.920] that as well.
[00:32:02.520] Mhm.
[00:32:03.560] Man, great answer. So, time is really
[00:32:05.880] speeding by here.
[00:32:06.880] I got it. I mean, my answers are short.
[00:32:09.840] So, if to jump over to the Mel Labs
[00:32:12.200] experiences, one of my major curiosities
[00:32:15.080] here, like I mentioned in that intro, is
[00:32:17.400] corporate involvement and this SAIC
[00:32:20.280] corporation in particular. What kind of
[00:32:21.840] details can you give us on that front?
[00:32:24.720] Well,
[00:32:25.880] in all honesty, it's been a very very
[00:32:27.960] long time since I've come across them.
[00:32:32.040] It was just some insiders and some
[00:32:34.960] meetings of some people in some of these
[00:32:38.080] covert monitoring abductees folks.
[00:32:42.840] Mhm. I came across a bunch of them.
[00:32:45.480] There's this There's this a bunch of
[00:32:46.960] them that were connected to SAIC or at
[00:32:50.040] least at one time. Right.
[00:32:51.560] I think it is lessened in its
[00:32:54.480] significance as when I came across it
[00:32:57.560] and I'm like, "Wow, what's this? All
[00:32:58.680] these people are connected." All these
[00:33:00.280] people are connected to a lot of things.
[00:33:01.800] That's just one of the organizations,
[00:33:03.480] you know?
[00:33:04.360] And and it's not like SAIC knows all
[00:33:06.680] about and is all involved. No, it's just
[00:33:08.040] a few perpetrators or people involved or
[00:33:11.760] people who are monitoring just happen to
[00:33:14.160] have a connection to that. And like I
[00:33:16.120] said, now it's other organizations. So,
[00:33:18.120] its significance is standing out by
[00:33:20.040] itself has has lessened over time and I
[00:33:23.840] have not
[00:33:25.320] come across it in probably at least 10
[00:33:29.200] years since I've even come across it as
[00:33:31.120] a continual connection. Now,
[00:33:33.680] some of those individuals are still
[00:33:35.000] involved with it. So, therefore, there
[00:33:36.240] would still be a connection cuz do they
[00:33:38.480] still have some connection to it? Yeah.
[00:33:40.280] Mhm.
[00:33:41.400] But, um it it it In other words, when I
[00:33:43.200] came across a pot it it it was just
[00:33:45.920] which is SAIC is what's
[00:33:48.320] uh
[00:33:50.160] uh I'm trying to remember what the
[00:33:51.240] letter stand for. Strategic Science
[00:33:53.560] Application International Corporation.
[00:33:55.520] Correct. Right, that's it.
[00:33:56.800] Science Application International
[00:33:58.280] Corporation.
[00:33:59.680] And and it was just a it's just a you
[00:34:01.320] know, corporate entity that does science
[00:34:03.240] research and stuff in in San Diego that
[00:34:06.120] that name just popped up you know, for
[00:34:07.960] me like 15 year
[00:34:09.520] it popped up for a little while it it
[00:34:11.040] with different people because at the
[00:34:13.040] time I think they were involved with it.
[00:34:14.679] Now, not so much, you know? So, that's
[00:34:17.040] it. And but it's a good representation
[00:34:19.760] of how that can happen. Yeah. I mean,
[00:34:22.720] everybody knows companies like Lockheed
[00:34:24.600] and Boeing and groups like DARPA are all
[00:34:26.760] part of this puzzle to some extent, but
[00:34:28.879] I'd assume there are some lesser-known
[00:34:31.000] corporations or off-the-radar groups
[00:34:33.320] that have popped up. Oh, sure. Well,
[00:34:35.480] when you get into, for instance, um
[00:34:37.879] okay, let's just take a subject like
[00:34:39.800] secret space program.
[00:34:41.919] Cuz that's a good one that's related
[00:34:43.399] directly to what we're talking about.
[00:34:44.399] Sure. And And so you go, "Okay, secret
[00:34:46.960] space program. Well, it ain't NASA doing
[00:34:49.280] it cuz then it's not secret, you know?"
[00:34:52.399] So it's like, "Okay, well, who's doing
[00:34:54.240] this? How do they farm stuff out?" Well,
[00:34:56.879] even now, a lot of military stuff is,
[00:34:59.480] you know, you get
[00:35:01.040] military complex and you get military
[00:35:03.280] contractors.
[00:35:04.840] You know? I mean, you go out to Area 51
[00:35:06.720] and the security is all handled by
[00:35:08.200] Wackenhut. Wackenhut's not the military.
[00:35:10.800] They're a contractor. So what happens
[00:35:12.840] with SAIC is they're a military
[00:35:14.960] contractor. And they're a space
[00:35:17.080] contractor with other ones. So So you
[00:35:19.720] get into these companies that are the
[00:35:21.240] subcontractors working for the shadow
[00:35:24.920] government, the corp- corp- you know,
[00:35:26.760] covert ops, whatever you want to call
[00:35:28.120] it. Mhm. And it break away civilization.
[00:35:32.520] Don't get me started on that. But those
[00:35:34.280] folks, they're the contractors to those.
[00:35:36.680] Of which, if you start digging, you will
[00:35:38.600] literally find a thousand companies, you
[00:35:40.880] know?
[00:35:41.520] Cuz everything is handled by different
[00:35:43.040] subcontractors. So one time, and maybe
[00:35:45.720] currently, I don't even know, SAIC was
[00:35:48.760] one of those subcontractors.
[00:35:51.000] But I do know meetings there. There were
[00:35:54.040] also a couple meetings at um another
[00:35:56.200] company in Georgia that keeps coming up.
[00:35:57.880] I'll think of their name in a second.
[00:35:59.200] Ah, shoot. I hate it when the brain
[00:36:00.640] doesn't work.
[00:36:01.880] Getting old is a man. Okay, I'll
[00:36:03.840] think of their name in a second, but
[00:36:04.920] another one Georgia where people met,
[00:36:06.360] you know? So there's these There's these
[00:36:07.920] companies that have been like a meeting
[00:36:10.240] place for some of these people for
[00:36:11.880] discussing whatever, and it was just
[00:36:13.920] cuz, you know, they were involved there
[00:36:15.600] and it and it was a current convenient
[00:36:18.040] place to meet and you could meet
[00:36:19.760] secretly in a conference room, etc.,
[00:36:21.760] etc. So these So again, that's just one
[00:36:24.600] of many I've come across. At the time,
[00:36:27.360] it seemed significant. And it And
[00:36:29.240] occasionally, like for I guess Robert
[00:36:31.720] came across it, right? That's what you
[00:36:32.920] were saying and used it in his book.
[00:36:34.400] Okay, well, occasionally it resurfaces.
[00:36:37.040] With the other ones, so
[00:36:38.840] there's multiple of these
[00:36:41.120] companies that will resurface and their
[00:36:43.160] name will pop up again because of some
[00:36:46.680] involvement or someone associate with
[00:36:48.480] them involved. So, I'm never surprised
[00:36:50.960] when I keep coming up with all these
[00:36:53.080] various names and and then they'll go
[00:36:54.960] away for a while and come back, you
[00:36:56.960] know, etc. etc. So, I'm not sure that he
[00:36:58.800] came
[00:36:59.840] I'm not What am I trying to say? I'm not
[00:37:01.920] surprised that he came across a SEIC
[00:37:05.520] connection. Mhm. And if he came to me
[00:37:07.240] and said, "Well, what about this
[00:37:08.280] company, this company, or this company?"
[00:37:10.200] I'd probably go, "Oh, yeah, those too."
[00:37:12.120] You know.
[00:37:13.160] I mean, I haven't heard all of them, you
[00:37:14.280] know, I've only heard a few here and
[00:37:15.440] there, but I'm not surprised when I hear
[00:37:17.320] Right. It's a revolving door, and that's
[00:37:19.000] how they keep it a secret. There's one
[00:37:20.160] that comes up a lot. There's There's a
[00:37:21.640] well-known one in Texas that comes up a
[00:37:23.560] lot because of the people involved with
[00:37:25.520] it.
[00:37:26.800] I'll I'll say one that keeps coming up
[00:37:29.520] in various ways, Bigelow Aerospace.
[00:37:32.160] There's one.
[00:37:32.840] Mhm. That's one currently coming up than
[00:37:35.320] SEIC, you know. It happens to be some of
[00:37:37.640] the same individuals, so and that's just
[00:37:39.960] one little group. That's
[00:37:41.720] in MILABs and in alien abduction,
[00:37:44.400] there's this term that an abductee
[00:37:47.200] who is also very well known in the
[00:37:48.760] remote viewing field and teaches that
[00:37:50.440] and everything by the name of Angela
[00:37:52.360] Thompson Smith. She wrote a book called
[00:37:55.440] Diary Diary of an Abduction? I don't I
[00:37:57.360] don't have it in front of me, but I'm
[00:37:58.240] pretty sure I think that's the name.
[00:38:00.040] Mhm. I'm at home doing this and my books
[00:38:01.880] are all in my office at work. Uh but
[00:38:04.720] Diary of an Diary of an Abduction Diary
[00:38:06.400] of an Abductee, I forget, but anyways,
[00:38:08.200] Diary Diary of an Abductee. And in that
[00:38:11.000] book, she talked about her own
[00:38:12.680] MILAB-related experiences. And
[00:38:14.640] obviously, MILAB We haven't really
[00:38:16.600] addressed this just is MIL for military
[00:38:18.600] and AB for abduction. So, it just means
[00:38:20.640] military abduction.
[00:38:21.880] Uh and again, I I hate the term, but I
[00:38:24.080] still use it cuz it's the term known by
[00:38:26.240] so many people.
[00:38:27.800] Uh but going back to what I was saying
[00:38:28.880] about her, she coined a term in that
[00:38:31.160] book for individuals that were involved
[00:38:35.440] in
[00:38:36.640] keeping tabs on her, monitoring her, uh
[00:38:39.920] befriending her and other abductees, and
[00:38:43.280] that term was minders, like you're being
[00:38:45.600] someone's minding you, okay?
[00:38:48.080] And I like the term because it just
[00:38:49.760] makes sense. It's you're being minded,
[00:38:52.000] you know, and someone's minding you.
[00:38:53.760] Sure. Um and uh and it's just where
[00:38:57.560] these individuals get involved in your
[00:38:59.280] life to varying degrees. So, outside of
[00:39:02.360] the abduction events, you could have
[00:39:05.400] these intelligence people, aerospace
[00:39:08.120] people, covert world, people who operate
[00:39:10.640] in covert projects on many levels, will
[00:39:13.280] suddenly befriend themselves to you. And
[00:39:15.480] sometimes the abductee sees it well,
[00:39:17.080] this is like a whistleblower providing
[00:39:19.240] me information, maybe confirming part of
[00:39:21.720] my experience. So, it's not necessarily
[00:39:23.920] bad. I have a couple of these
[00:39:25.920] individuals and I have over time and
[00:39:28.760] they've kind of switched positions with
[00:39:30.560] each other.
[00:39:31.680] And and I don't see it as something bad.
[00:39:33.880] I see it as okay, I'm flagged, I'm of
[00:39:36.680] interest, so I renewed that in a million
[00:39:38.640] ways, have been for a long time. So,
[00:39:40.120] it's like, okay, so they're kind of
[00:39:41.800] keeping tabs on me. And yet I also kind
[00:39:44.200] of get fed some information. Of course,
[00:39:46.400] you you take that with a grain of salt
[00:39:48.320] and you don't you don't necessarily
[00:39:49.600] believe everything, but you don't
[00:39:50.440] necessarily disbelieve it. It's like, is
[00:39:51.800] this useful? But it usually fits my
[00:39:53.560] research or supports. Mhm. So, they're
[00:39:55.560] kind of, you know, they're leading you
[00:39:56.680] along by the nose. Yeah, but I admit
[00:39:58.800] that and and it's not I'm not going to
[00:40:01.040] turn around and spout something they say
[00:40:02.720] is the god's truth cuz I'm not an idiot,
[00:40:05.720] you know? But at the same time, it's
[00:40:06.960] like, okay, so far it's helpful, it's
[00:40:09.360] interesting, and it's confirming of some
[00:40:12.000] stuff.
[00:40:13.240] She had that, too. And she's also
[00:40:15.120] befriended, you know, or become very
[00:40:17.080] good friends with some of them. Right.
[00:40:18.720] Sometimes in that in the minor
[00:40:20.480] scenarios, there can be threats and
[00:40:22.680] warnings. Sometimes they get into very
[00:40:25.840] abusive relationships.
[00:40:28.360] Some people end up getting into romantic
[00:40:31.520] relationships with someone in that role.
[00:40:34.600] Mhm. And those usually end very badly.
[00:40:38.160] I can understand that.
[00:40:39.440] Yeah. And now in my case, I've never
[00:40:42.720] gotten involved into my knowledge. Well,
[00:40:44.720] actually, I take that back. There was
[00:40:46.360] someone loosely involved that was almost
[00:40:48.400] a little romantic thing, but but it was
[00:40:50.280] short-lived and and it's okay. But but
[00:40:52.680] he was an insider and kind of a
[00:40:54.360] whistleblower for sure.
[00:40:56.240] This can happen. And I tell abductees,
[00:40:59.120] be leery, know the background of the
[00:41:01.320] person. If you start dating someone,
[00:41:02.960] what's their background? Even if you
[00:41:05.320] have someone who seems like they come
[00:41:07.760] from the corporate world as a
[00:41:09.200] whistleblower providing you information,
[00:41:11.760] think, well, why? Why why are they What
[00:41:13.760] is this leading to? Right. A handler
[00:41:15.760] situation, perhaps. A handler. And it
[00:41:18.600] could be towards eventually recruiting
[00:41:21.160] you. They're checking you out on deeper
[00:41:22.560] level. I mean, if you if you flag that
[00:41:24.800] kind of involvement, you're way down the
[00:41:27.640] the
[00:41:28.800] The
[00:41:29.640] curve, as I say, you know, you know,
[00:41:31.600] yeah. And and so it's like, what's
[00:41:33.920] coming next? What do they want to get
[00:41:35.560] you involved with? And then you can
[00:41:37.320] either choose to say okay or no to
[00:41:39.960] something that you might be proposed to
[00:41:41.680] you. Mhm. But be very cautious. Yeah.
[00:41:44.720] And some people get very paranoid when
[00:41:46.240] this starts to happen.
[00:41:48.120] And again, it can be very low-grade,
[00:41:49.840] like I was saying earlier. The mild
[00:41:51.640] level of involvement can start with just
[00:41:53.480] really basic harassment, surveillance
[00:41:55.880] kind of stuff. And then and then can
[00:41:58.160] just slowly escalate and ramp up to more
[00:42:01.080] and more. And so it may not involve
[00:42:03.520] getting abducted by these covert humans
[00:42:06.360] or having covert humans present in an ET
[00:42:08.960] abduction. That may come later.
[00:42:12.000] And even if that happens, it doesn't
[00:42:14.400] necessarily move beyond that. So again,
[00:42:16.160] you could be anywhere along
[00:42:18.160] that curve of ramping up in your life
[00:42:20.680] and and then have it stop. Or have it
[00:42:23.000] stop for a while and start up again. I
[00:42:24.520] mean, that happens for people.
[00:42:26.480] Or just keep repeating through the same
[00:42:28.120] cycle. Just as how much are they
[00:42:30.160] interested in you, how involved. Cuz if
[00:42:32.320] you think about it, these are groups and
[00:42:34.000] organizations
[00:42:35.640] and if they are connected to something
[00:42:37.760] official as far as shadow government or
[00:42:40.040] covert ops or something or military.
[00:42:42.720] Well, they're spending time, energy, and
[00:42:44.400] money on you.
[00:42:45.920] And how much time, energy, personnel,
[00:42:48.160] and how much money are they going to
[00:42:49.680] spend on you depends on How valuable
[00:42:52.480] Are you useful? Yeah, how valuable you
[00:42:54.360] are to them. Exactly.
[00:42:56.120] And so a lot of times they just check
[00:42:57.600] someone out and realize, nope, it's not
[00:43:00.600] what I want. Or that person's such a
[00:43:02.720] pain in the ass that we don't want to be
[00:43:04.280] involved with them. And I think that's
[00:43:05.840] happened to me a couple times cuz I'll
[00:43:07.360] get a little involvement and then
[00:43:08.200] they'll leave me alone for a long time
[00:43:09.520] and I'm thinking, they're like, somebody
[00:43:11.400] goes, not not worth it.
[00:43:15.360] Cuz they know anything they do to me,
[00:43:16.920] I'm going to go blah blah blah blah
[00:43:18.280] blah. Yeah.
[00:43:19.240] And people say, well, how do I get them
[00:43:20.280] to leave me alone? And I go, I always
[00:43:21.680] tell people, if this starts happening to
[00:43:23.560] you, the best way to get them to leave
[00:43:24.720] you alone, go public and talk about it.
[00:43:26.800] Start talking, yeah. You become become
[00:43:29.360] more of a hassle than you're worth.
[00:43:31.960] So, another element I want to talk about
[00:43:34.200] is getting back to technology just a
[00:43:35.840] little bit. A big part of the secrecy
[00:43:37.560] we're told is always that it has to do
[00:43:39.680] with the technologies involved that
[00:43:41.720] these kind of technologies could put the
[00:43:43.360] energy companies out of business. All
[00:43:44.880] that kind of speculation. I've heard you
[00:43:46.920] talk about the idea that we're having a
[00:43:49.200] slow indoctrination to disclosure on
[00:43:51.840] some of these things. And that's that's
[00:43:53.360] interesting because
[00:43:55.120] this this guy
[00:43:56.680] this guy Gordon White, he never ceases
[00:43:58.440] to blow my mind, but he's talked about
[00:43:59.920] some of the major trade agreements and
[00:44:01.840] things like the Trans-Pacific
[00:44:03.120] Partnership as potential evidence for
[00:44:05.440] this that it could quite possibly be the
[00:44:07.520] legal and political framework for
[00:44:09.200] releasing some of this tech without
[00:44:10.600] losing control of it. Are there any
[00:44:13.160] things like that that you would point to
[00:44:14.960] to suggest that this rollout is being
[00:44:16.880] prepared?
[00:44:18.200] A part of me is like, where do I start?
[00:44:20.240] I mean, yeah, I'd like to hear what he
[00:44:21.720] said. I'm not familiar with his stuff
[00:44:23.240] and it sounds like he might be really on
[00:44:24.760] it.
[00:44:25.840] So, I should check that out. I admit,
[00:44:27.800] sometimes I just get so caught up in
[00:44:29.560] regular life that I I'm not always
[00:44:32.040] progressing forward with the research in
[00:44:34.280] the way that I should. And again,
[00:44:35.560] triage. I'm usually helping people
[00:44:37.400] who've had experiences
[00:44:39.360] come to terms with have they had any
[00:44:40.920] mylab stuff and if so, why? And you
[00:44:42.600] know, it's just again, triage. So, but
[00:44:45.120] that's one area as far as someone who
[00:44:46.840] says, "Look, I think this is the
[00:44:48.840] framework for disclosure happening." I'm
[00:44:50.840] very interested. Of course, I know
[00:44:52.640] Bassett real well and follow his stuff
[00:44:54.440] and I was following all the the Greer
[00:44:56.360] stuff when he was doing disclosure.
[00:44:58.600] Mhm. Not so much lately. I know. Isn't
[00:45:00.680] he doing some weird stuff now? Yeah,
[00:45:01.880] yeah, yeah, yeah. This this this tour
[00:45:04.000] I'm here to save you stuff is not
[00:45:05.600] working for me or for him. Agreed. So,
[00:45:08.400] if not the TPP, what are the things that
[00:45:11.200] are the clues that show you that there
[00:45:13.080] is some type of indication that there's
[00:45:15.400] disclosure coming? Oh, god. Okay. I'll
[00:45:18.680] stick I'll start with two things.
[00:45:22.600] That stand out like sore thumbs.
[00:45:24.360] Sure. I'm not sure which to make number
[00:45:26.400] one.
[00:45:27.720] I'm going to start with the one I might
[00:45:28.880] have more trouble remembering once I
[00:45:30.480] start talking about the other. So, I'll
[00:45:31.760] start with the one
[00:45:33.280] which is and may maybe it's number two,
[00:45:35.920] but just so I don't so I don't spend so
[00:45:38.080] much time talking about the other that I
[00:45:39.240] don't talk about this.
[00:45:41.160] And the first So, the first one I'll say
[00:45:42.560] is the amount of whistleblowers and
[00:45:44.640] insiders coming out talking and saying,
[00:45:46.640] "I was told to talk about this." Which
[00:45:48.320] is right now rife and rampant in
[00:45:50.080] ufology.
[00:45:51.880] And in the covert conspiracy worlds and
[00:45:55.080] everything everything from Basiago
[00:45:57.200] running for president to you know, to
[00:45:59.600] everyone asks me about Corey Goode all
[00:46:01.120] the time, you know, all these kinds of
[00:46:02.480] things. So, I think I I just think
[00:46:05.360] there's so many insiders coming out and
[00:46:07.960] talking and pretty much all of them say,
[00:46:10.880] "I'm being told to do this. I'm being
[00:46:12.480] allowed to say certain things. It's
[00:46:13.920] being encouraged."
[00:46:15.560] That there's some and it and when you
[00:46:17.560] you know, when you say the shadow world,
[00:46:19.080] it's not like one unanimous thought or
[00:46:21.840] or body, you know, making decisions. It
[00:46:24.480] could be one group wanting some
[00:46:26.160] information out in direct face of
[00:46:28.880] someone another group who doesn't, you
[00:46:30.720] know what I mean? Mhm. It could be but
[00:46:32.640] in in the case of so many of these
[00:46:34.440] individuals, all the people that Kerry
[00:46:36.400] Cassidy's been interviewing and I mean,
[00:46:38.040] I could I mean, I don't want to start
[00:46:39.520] listing names but I could probably off
[00:46:40.960] the top of my head just ramble off and
[00:46:43.480] there's these they're all just starting
[00:46:45.080] to talk about their involvement in these
[00:46:47.520] deep projects that are secret space
[00:46:50.360] program projects and technology
[00:46:52.880] development projects and sci development
[00:46:55.760] projects and you know, all these various
[00:46:57.400] aspects of the subject. And they're
[00:46:59.560] saying, "I'm literally being told to
[00:47:00.960] talk about this." And and I think people
[00:47:03.320] miss that part of their message. Oh,
[00:47:05.320] what do you think about this? Do you
[00:47:06.200] think he's really involved? And I go,
[00:47:07.200] "You guys, are you listening to the fact
[00:47:08.400] that he keeps saying, you know, like
[00:47:10.120] Corey Goode keeps saying,
[00:47:11.800] 'I'm being told to talk about this.'"
[00:47:13.560] And and therefore, take a lot of what
[00:47:15.320] they say with a grain of salt. Are you
[00:47:16.720] really getting the truth? You getting
[00:47:17.800] what they want you to hear? And what are
[00:47:19.320] they leaving out? Now, that person may
[00:47:21.760] have to I've met Corey Goode and had
[00:47:23.320] dinner with him and his wife and I
[00:47:24.800] thought and they talked all about their
[00:47:26.280] kids and he was really down-to-earth and
[00:47:27.960] I was pleasantly surprised to learn all
[00:47:30.000] that about. And then you go, "Okay,
[00:47:32.080] well, and he said, you know, I am being
[00:47:33.520] told to talk about this." And and you
[00:47:35.320] go, "Okay, so he's saying what he can.
[00:47:37.000] He knows what he can't. I think he has
[00:47:39.080] good intentions. I don't think he has a
[00:47:41.280] lot of ulterior motives other than to
[00:47:43.240] say what he can. I think it's like
[00:47:45.520] therapy for him." I think that with a
[00:47:47.200] lot of these guys. I knew I knew Bill
[00:47:49.520] Uhouse. Uh he unfortunately has passed
[00:47:51.360] away but I knew Bill Uhouse really well
[00:47:53.200] and that was his whole thing. Mhm. And
[00:47:55.320] when he when he pushed it too far, he
[00:47:57.080] got shot. You know, that didn't kill
[00:47:59.120] him, but he did, you know. And and Corey
[00:48:00.880] Goode knows what will get him hurt. I
[00:48:02.160] mean, these guys know what they can't
[00:48:03.720] say that is that's too much, you know.
[00:48:05.680] Right. That was one of my questions for
[00:48:06.880] you is there's definitely a sea change
[00:48:08.840] where they seem to be talking about a
[00:48:10.240] lot of stuff that wasn't previously
[00:48:12.080] talked about, but as far as those
[00:48:14.160] sensitive subjects that they seem to not
[00:48:17.320] they're not supposed to go into, what do
[00:48:19.760] those subjects seem to revolve around as
[00:48:22.520] far as you've noticed? I don't even know
[00:48:24.720] cuz you you don't you don't know what
[00:48:26.080] you don't know. You don't know what
[00:48:26.880] they're not saying.
[00:48:27.640] Right.
[00:48:28.040] They're saying some pretty wild stuff.
[00:48:29.760] Yeah, Corey Goode talks about the inner
[00:48:31.520] earth stuff, which is fascinating to me.
[00:48:33.560] Yeah.
[00:48:34.400] What's off the table? I I don't know.
[00:48:36.640] Maybe
[00:48:37.880] I don't think they're getting into a lot
[00:48:40.080] of why the ETs are really here stuff,
[00:48:42.640] the alien agenda and motive stuff. Mhm.
[00:48:45.040] I don't think they're getting into that
[00:48:46.280] so much. I think they talk about the
[00:48:48.200] programs, but not why. Mhm. And what
[00:48:50.800] they're trying to do with those
[00:48:51.920] programs. So, that's just my guess, but
[00:48:54.760] truth is I I I And then the other thing
[00:48:56.880] is I admit I don't follow these guys
[00:48:58.360] that closely. You start hearing them and
[00:49:00.440] they and they just it all just sounds
[00:49:01.880] like so much stuff and you're like, how
[00:49:03.520] do you ever verify any of this? How do
[00:49:04.920] you know if it's true? Right. It just
[00:49:07.120] becomes noise after a while. Exactly.
[00:49:09.920] Agreed.
[00:49:10.560] And yet I could be missing something
[00:49:12.080] significant by not paying more attention
[00:49:13.920] to them. But I leave that to obviously
[00:49:17.120] David Wilcock and
[00:49:18.880] and earlier I mentioned uh um Project
[00:49:21.520] Camelot and and and what Bill was doing
[00:49:24.560] and what Kerry was doing. You know, I
[00:49:26.280] leave it to folks like that who follow
[00:49:27.960] it and say, "Okay, what did they say
[00:49:29.000] now? What's different? How's this
[00:49:30.120] related to what someone said before?"
[00:49:31.720] And those people make a whole research
[00:49:34.040] community out of that and great, that's
[00:49:36.480] good. I'm glad they're doing it then I
[00:49:37.720] don't have to.
[00:49:39.280] You know, and then I can if I really
[00:49:41.240] want to know, can ask David Wilcock or
[00:49:43.320] Kerry Cassidy and say, "Now, what do you
[00:49:44.680] think about this person?" And
[00:49:47.080] did that sound like what this other
[00:49:48.320] person ever said? Cuz they'll go, "Oh,
[00:49:49.720] yeah, la la la la la." And all the cross
[00:49:51.400] correlation. Because that's their
[00:49:53.240] research again.
[00:49:54.760] In my research I'm still
[00:49:56.400] the poor abductees who are wondering
[00:49:57.840] what the hell's happening to them. Yeah.
[00:50:00.160] And unfortunately, I'm kind of stuck
[00:50:01.800] there. But I only have so much time and
[00:50:03.520] energy. I mean, I have a full life and
[00:50:05.960] Of course. And yet that needs to happen.
[00:50:07.960] A lot of people say, "Hey Melinda, don't
[00:50:09.160] ever feel bad about doing that. That
[00:50:11.360] needs to happen. The abductee needs that
[00:50:13.440] spokesperson. I'm out there talking
[00:50:15.720] about the my lab events happening to
[00:50:17.360] people." Right.
[00:50:18.640] And that's so that's my gig if you will.
[00:50:20.720] And yet and yet these people who do
[00:50:23.240] follow
[00:50:24.720] again, you know, I think of Kerry
[00:50:26.000] Cassidy, Deb Wilcox off the top of my
[00:50:27.480] head is say we follow what these other
[00:50:29.160] people are saying and we cross correlate
[00:50:31.000] what they're saying. And and and I can
[00:50:33.000] think of oh, what's his name? Steve and
[00:50:34.960] then Tonya Mann form and and I forget
[00:50:37.360] the guy name she made the movie with
[00:50:39.920] Packing for Mars. But so they're
[00:50:41.280] following what these guys are saying. So
[00:50:43.120] it's like, "Okay, there's enough people
[00:50:44.440] following that that I can I know where
[00:50:46.720] to go get that data when I when I want
[00:50:48.720] to know it" kind of thing. But again,
[00:50:50.400] for me for me personally it starts to
[00:50:52.120] just be so much noise. You start hearing
[00:50:54.600] all these people and you're like, "Okay,
[00:50:56.120] this is all very interesting. I'm really
[00:50:58.680] like, where's the evidence?" And I'm not
[00:51:00.360] saying they're not legit. I'm just
[00:51:01.760] saying, "Bring out the evidence or
[00:51:03.560] you're wasting my time." When I work
[00:51:05.680] with abductees, I help gather the
[00:51:08.200] evidence for their experiences.
[00:51:10.200] And let's talk about some of that
[00:51:11.240] physical evidence cuz you have talked
[00:51:12.920] about that. You've talked about not only
[00:51:14.960] implants, which most people have heard
[00:51:16.680] about, but other little indications that
[00:51:20.000] people's stories do check out. Can you
[00:51:22.280] tell us about some of those examples?
[00:51:24.040] Yeah. Yeah, before we get into that,
[00:51:26.040] people might realize we might have left
[00:51:27.920] them hanging in what I think was the
[00:51:29.640] number one thing that tells us
[00:51:31.000] disclosure is coming.
[00:51:32.760] It is current topic politically right
[00:51:35.280] now in our presidential race. Mhm. Now,
[00:51:38.120] whether that means anything's going to
[00:51:39.320] come of it or not, I don't know. But
[00:51:41.280] every word these folks utter, well, not
[00:51:43.400] so much. I used to think every
[00:51:45.400] word they uttered was planned.
[00:51:47.680] I'm beginning to wonder. But, having had
[00:51:50.400] said that,
[00:51:51.520] the information that John Podesta put
[00:51:53.600] out in the tweets that he put out in his
[00:51:55.200] last days of office working as working
[00:51:58.440] for Obama
[00:51:59.720] as
[00:52:01.280] was he chief of staff of the White
[00:52:02.720] House.
[00:52:03.640] And now being campaign director for
[00:52:06.400] Hillary. And the comments that Hillary
[00:52:10.000] keeps making over and over again. You
[00:52:12.360] guys the fact that this isn't this isn't
[00:52:16.240] This is being said over and over and
[00:52:19.880] over. Something's afoot.
[00:52:22.520] Yeah.
[00:52:23.880] What are they doing that? Why she's
[00:52:26.520] making an issue of it? Is she Is she
[00:52:28.520] really going to go look at it?
[00:52:30.160] I doubt it. Are they going to
[00:52:33.040] send up a smoke screen?
[00:52:35.200] You know,
[00:52:36.720] um
[00:52:36.800] I think she's just pandering to the
[00:52:38.160] internet community.
[00:52:39.840] I doubt that an insider like her would
[00:52:41.760] really expose much.
[00:52:43.720] No, but you but you have That's easy to
[00:52:46.000] say, but you have to go back and realize
[00:52:49.400] their previous involvement, their
[00:52:50.840] previous questions.
[00:52:52.840] It's more serious than you think and I
[00:52:54.680] think it's
[00:52:55.960] Pandering to the internet means what?
[00:52:57.680] That's nobody. Come on, that's you know.
[00:53:00.160] Really.
[00:53:00.760] we're talking about it. Yeah, okay, but
[00:53:02.840] I'm just saying I I No, I don't think
[00:53:04.720] so. Not that much of the internet
[00:53:06.760] community even has an interest in the
[00:53:08.600] subject. Okay.
[00:53:10.120] Um
[00:53:11.600] when you go back to people she's
[00:53:13.360] connected with, the questions she's
[00:53:15.080] asked on the inside, um the books she's
[00:53:18.400] read, how long her and Bill have been
[00:53:20.520] pursuing this. This isn't like, "Oh, I'm
[00:53:22.680] just going to do this right now cuz it's
[00:53:24.160] trendy and current." She It's not brand
[00:53:26.320] new for her. This has been a 20-year gig
[00:53:28.360] for her, you know, and it's It's been
[00:53:30.600] behind the scenes. And what's
[00:53:32.400] interesting is it's suddenly come from
[00:53:33.880] behind the scenes out in the open. Why
[00:53:36.640] bringing it out in the open, Hillary,
[00:53:38.120] all of a sudden when you've been
[00:53:39.000] secretly doing this for a long time? Not
[00:53:40.640] even secretly, you've been doing this
[00:53:42.000] with your friends and close associates
[00:53:44.040] and words been leaking out, but now
[00:53:45.440] you're publicly stating it. Mhm. When
[00:53:47.760] before you and Bill went publicly asked,
[00:53:49.720] would dance around it or run away. Now
[00:53:51.960] you're publicly stating it. What's going
[00:53:54.320] on? And Podesta, come on, you guys, he
[00:53:56.480] was chief of staff of the White House
[00:53:57.960] saying his biggest regret is he didn't
[00:53:59.800] get that done. It's like something's a
[00:54:01.480] foot and I don't know what that means.
[00:54:03.520] Is it Is it we're being primed for some
[00:54:06.080] kind of smoke screen to deflect and say,
[00:54:08.200] "Oh, look, there's nothing to it after
[00:54:09.560] all."
[00:54:10.680] Mhm.
[00:54:11.680] Why? The question It's not that they're
[00:54:13.520] going to come out with disclosures, why
[00:54:15.160] now? And what is their end game? That's
[00:54:18.320] what we got to ask. But I think
[00:54:19.960] something's a foot because it is current
[00:54:21.920] topic. Right. I I don't think they have
[00:54:24.600] much wiggle room left.
[00:54:26.120] I think I don't I think the involvement
[00:54:29.080] of Tom DeLonge
[00:54:30.840] Right. Blink-182. Yeah, we're talking
[00:54:32.800] about maybe getting him on here.
[00:54:34.760] Yeah, well, I hope he can.
[00:54:36.640] But But I think that's very curious.
[00:54:38.480] Who's talking to him and why? Do they
[00:54:40.400] think he's the voice of the young
[00:54:41.440] people? Why did they choose him? Yeah, I
[00:54:42.760] get why they chose him. It's He's the
[00:54:44.840] voice of the young people. I get it.
[00:54:46.800] But who's trying to set up the young
[00:54:48.560] people for whatever this agenda is? Why
[00:54:51.360] him? And who is he talking to him and
[00:54:53.640] why are they being so freely talking to
[00:54:55.440] him? Again, you guys, if he is really
[00:54:58.200] meeting with Pentagon officials and
[00:54:59.960] stuff like he claims, and I believe he
[00:55:02.040] is. I don't believe he's making that up.
[00:55:03.720] If he's really hearing the stuff that he
[00:55:05.320] is, and and if you listen to what he's
[00:55:08.160] saying, he's saying, "Oh, I totally
[00:55:10.200] agree with why they've done this." He
[00:55:12.560] sings their praises. They've done no
[00:55:14.160] wrong. There's nothing illegal. When you
[00:55:16.040] understand why, you will accept it, too.
[00:55:19.120] And that to me sends up a tremendous red
[00:55:21.280] flag. Right. Cuz I'm like, wait a
[00:55:24.640] second. If this is the voice of the
[00:55:26.760] 20-something crowd, you know, the 15 to
[00:55:29.240] 25-year-olds, and this is the guy that's
[00:55:31.960] talking to them, and this is the message
[00:55:35.000] they're going to start putting out. "Oh,
[00:55:36.080] there's nothing wrong. They're They've
[00:55:37.200] not done anything illegal. Everything's
[00:55:38.920] okay. It's all justified.
[00:55:41.120] There's been no policy of disclosure for
[00:55:42.680] completely justified Right. It's like
[00:55:45.000] they're setting us up for uh the idea of
[00:55:47.200] immunity, but I'm willing to give them
[00:55:48.760] immunity for disclosure. I'll make that
[00:55:50.680] trade. Hello. Yeah, I'm I I find what he
[00:55:53.600] says curious and alarming. Right. But I
[00:55:57.120] But I'm going to pay attention because
[00:55:58.640] somebody's talking to him and why and
[00:56:00.480] what are they saying? And I'm looking
[00:56:02.480] for the day when he wakes up and the
[00:56:03.920] light bulb goes off and he goes, "Wait a
[00:56:05.600] second." Cuz dude, you are being used.
[00:56:07.960] You're being had. You're being used. I
[00:56:09.840] hope you fully realize that.
[00:56:13.200] Maybe he's playing along. He seems like
[00:56:14.600] a smart guy, so he might just be playing
[00:56:16.160] along to see how far it goes. Mhm. But I
[00:56:18.600] If he If he turns tail on them
[00:56:21.760] Right.
[00:56:22.400] "No, I'm not going to put out that
[00:56:23.440] message." But we'll see. I mean, we'll
[00:56:24.800] see. And I'm not sure what to make of
[00:56:27.240] it. I mean, I The jury's still out. I
[00:56:28.880] haven't made up my mind. On many of
[00:56:30.120] these things, I haven't made up my mind,
[00:56:31.320] but they are curious. And And his whole
[00:56:33.280] ball wax The meantime, Hillary and John
[00:56:36.040] Podesta are making those statements.
[00:56:37.960] Yeah. It's like something's afoot. Well,
[00:56:40.560] I think in some way they don't have a
[00:56:42.440] lot of room left because a lot of these
[00:56:45.400] secret sciences and technologies have
[00:56:47.120] been quarantined, but yet people have
[00:56:49.080] stumbled on them more and more over
[00:56:50.800] time. Physics is only working with half
[00:56:53.120] a puzzle, so I think they have really no
[00:56:54.960] choice but to put this out to us, but
[00:56:57.320] try to get out in front of it so that
[00:56:58.920] they can profit like they've always
[00:57:00.560] profited. Yeah, I think you're right. I
[00:57:02.520] think it might be now we're just looking
[00:57:05.000] stupid and so we got to come out with
[00:57:06.880] this. And Oh, another thing that's
[00:57:08.160] pressing that. So you have the whole Tom
[00:57:10.200] DeLonge thing. You have You have Podesta
[00:57:11.720] and Hillary and that whole thing. At the
[00:57:13.440] same time, part of what's pushing that
[00:57:15.240] is you have Putin pushing the button on
[00:57:17.400] it. Right.
[00:57:18.080] Putin is saying, "I'm going to come out
[00:57:19.320] and do this if you guys don't." He's
[00:57:21.360] He's threatened that publicly in
[00:57:23.080] lectures like five times or something.
[00:57:25.240] "If you don't do this, I'm going to."
[00:57:27.480] Mhm. Our government's going, "Well, we
[00:57:28.960] can't let him do do first."
[00:57:31.480] Right. That would be a mess for a
[00:57:33.520] million reasons.
[00:57:35.560] For the whole world, that would be a
[00:57:36.760] mess. And so they probably realized we
[00:57:38.840] got it we can't let him do this first.
[00:57:41.240] Mhm. And if he's And if he's really
[00:57:42.880] pushing some of that threat, that could
[00:57:44.320] be driving some of it, too.
[00:57:46.360] Along
[00:57:47.960] it cuz that to me that tied directly in
[00:57:49.840] with what you're saying with with the
[00:57:52.160] technologies are out there to move
[00:57:54.360] forward and to really profit them, they
[00:57:56.760] got to start bringing everybody along.
[00:57:58.760] Mhm.
[00:57:59.800] I think you're right. Cuz I think I I
[00:58:01.920] don't think these folks ever do anything
[00:58:03.440] that isn't completely profit and
[00:58:05.440] financial gain based and driven. Right.
[00:58:07.680] And well calculated, too. Yeah. Yeah,
[00:58:09.560] exactly. You got it. You got it.
[00:58:11.480] I I'm I agree. I think you're on it.
[00:58:13.320] Well, we're getting down to it. I know
[00:58:14.600] you're also going to be at Contact in
[00:58:15.800] the Desert coming up. It's a great event
[00:58:17.600] where I've actually gotten my hands on
[00:58:19.160] night vision goggles the past couple
[00:58:20.760] years and saw a lot of odd stuff in the
[00:58:22.560] sky. So I have full faith in the idea of
[00:58:25.520] your UFO tours, but give us some details
[00:58:28.080] on what those are like. What do you see
[00:58:30.080] in when when you're looking out there in
[00:58:31.640] the night vision goggles?
[00:58:33.600] Well, last night was tour number
[00:58:38.200] 574.
[00:58:40.280] Wow. So in 574
[00:58:42.880] tours, only once did my clients feel
[00:58:44.760] they didn't have a sighting. The other
[00:58:46.320] 573 tours
[00:58:48.760] The other 573 tours, my clients always
[00:58:51.280] thought they had sightings. And we see a
[00:58:53.000] variety of stuff. We you know, I I
[00:58:55.120] always tell my clients I don't know
[00:58:56.280] whether we're going to get 10 or 40 or
[00:58:58.120] 10 or 50, but you know, I would think my
[00:59:00.480] clients last night would probably tell
[00:59:02.240] you that they saw 30 or so. So we always
[00:59:05.000] see a bunch of stuff. I educate everyone
[00:59:07.120] on planes, helicopters, shooting stars,
[00:59:10.160] and of course satellites. So you know
[00:59:12.120] all about when you're seeing those
[00:59:13.400] things and you can rule those things
[00:59:14.960] out. So when you have things that stop,
[00:59:16.920] turn, change And when I say things, I
[00:59:19.160] predominantly what we're getting are
[00:59:20.280] lights at high altitude, predominantly.
[00:59:22.000] Right. On 15 of the tours, we've seen
[00:59:24.640] fully structured craft. Like two times
[00:59:27.000] were big discs, six times were big
[00:59:28.920] triangles, two two times were big
[00:59:31.200] boomerang shapes, one time was a big
[00:59:32.960] teardrop shape, one time a big diamond,
[00:59:35.280] and three times we had big round
[00:59:36.760] spheres, like, you know, ball shape.
[00:59:38.800] But, and two times your classic UFO
[00:59:41.040] disc. And like I said, six times big
[00:59:43.040] triangles. Okay, but and sometimes those
[00:59:46.000] have been 3 in in diameter at arm's
[00:59:48.720] length. So, you make 3 in diameter at
[00:59:50.360] arm's length, make that a solid object,
[00:59:51.920] take your hand down your times,
[00:59:53.400] something hovering right over you.
[00:59:55.320] And sometimes they've been maybe an
[00:59:58.040] quarter inch at arm's length. Hm. But if
[01:00:00.480] we're seeing full structure, and so
[01:00:02.400] we've had triangles up high that are
[01:00:04.640] half an inch at arm's length, and we've
[01:00:06.040] had triangles that I had a professional
[01:00:08.200] pilot out in one night who said it
[01:00:09.880] thought it was about 4 or 500 ft above
[01:00:11.640] us. Two great big triangles that we
[01:00:13.200] thought were about 300 ft in diameter,
[01:00:15.520] only about 500 ft above us. In other
[01:00:17.080] words, right on top of us. Yeah. So, you
[01:00:19.120] know, so but but 15 times we've seen
[01:00:21.640] structured craft, and all the other
[01:00:22.800] times we're seeing lights at high
[01:00:24.000] altitude. Right, that's what I've seen.
[01:00:26.360] Occasionally we get great big lights,
[01:00:29.120] and my clients will go, "Oh my god,
[01:00:30.200] that's so close, that's so close. What
[01:00:31.440] shape is it?" You know, what shape? And
[01:00:34.080] I'll say that shape is big light.
[01:00:36.600] Huh. Cuz it's not structure unless you
[01:00:38.800] can see structure. But we get big light
[01:00:40.640] a lot. But we also get lights at really
[01:00:43.040] high altitude. But things that stop,
[01:00:44.840] turn, change direction, wobble, zigzag,
[01:00:48.400] make right angle turns, make U-turns,
[01:00:50.880] shoot off into space. Last night we had
[01:00:52.560] a couple that as they took off out of
[01:00:54.760] the atmosphere, they were getting dimmer
[01:00:56.080] and smaller, you could tell that they
[01:00:58.160] suddenly were going three times faster,
[01:00:59.720] like they were going faster faster
[01:01:01.040] faster faster faster, and then they go
[01:01:02.200] shoo and shoot out, like, you know, like
[01:01:03.720] streak out.
[01:01:04.480] Mhm. It's always a combination. We also
[01:01:06.560] get things that fly in formations. Not
[01:01:09.400] last night, but night before last we had
[01:01:11.640] a triangle of three three separate
[01:01:13.840] objects flying in a triangle formation.
[01:01:16.560] And we also had that happen about seven
[01:01:19.640] nights ago. We had Oh my god, we had a
[01:01:22.360] good a good triple. Oh my god, it was so
[01:01:24.760] good. It was coming from the southeast
[01:01:27.480] straight towards us. Three separate
[01:01:29.200] objects. You could see stars between
[01:01:31.040] them and they're kind of a distance
[01:01:32.040] apart, you know, but perfect equilateral
[01:01:35.240] perfectly evenly spaced from each other.
[01:01:37.640] All of a sudden the one in the front
[01:01:39.200] starts dropping to the left and the two
[01:01:42.200] the other two kind of behind us was like
[01:01:43.720] one in the front, two in the back, I
[01:01:44.800] guess. They they start turning and
[01:01:47.000] keeping that exact shape. They do this
[01:01:49.720] U-turn. So, they'd come up from the
[01:01:51.680] southeast and they took off due east.
[01:01:54.200] And they they just kind of did this big
[01:01:56.240] arcing U-turn and took off due east
[01:01:58.600] holding that
[01:02:00.040] and as they flew away from us, they then
[01:02:03.000] were starting to go up and out of the
[01:02:04.360] atmosphere because they were getting
[01:02:06.320] smaller, dimmer, and closer together all
[01:02:08.160] at the same time, meaning they were
[01:02:09.200] holding that exact formation, but as it
[01:02:11.720] flew out away from us, they got not only
[01:02:13.920] dimmer, tinier, dimmer, tinier, but much
[01:02:16.400] closer together and they were like tiny
[01:02:19.160] really close together before they
[01:02:20.720] finally completely disappeared. So, they
[01:02:22.640] had made a big U-turn and then took off
[01:02:24.280] for space holding that exact formation.
[01:02:27.200] It was just a perfect textbook triad,
[01:02:30.240] you know, it was just awesome. I think I
[01:02:32.840] had I had I had two clients with me that
[01:02:35.440] night, a couple who are making a
[01:02:37.600] documentary
[01:02:39.240] and they're going to be at Contact in
[01:02:40.880] the Desert interviewing and filming
[01:02:42.640] people with the documenter for Contact
[01:02:45.400] in the Desert. Like they're officially
[01:02:46.640] doing it in conjunction with Contact in
[01:02:49.120] the Desert and whether it's a
[01:02:50.840] documentary just about that or
[01:02:52.440] documentary about current ufology and
[01:02:54.160] they're just going to do a a big part of
[01:02:55.840] that. But if anyone out there's going to
[01:02:57.400] be at Contact or is a speaker there or
[01:02:59.560] anything,
[01:03:00.800] you're going to meet these guys, this
[01:03:02.000] lovely couple. I think he's from Brazil
[01:03:05.320] and they were the ones I had out there
[01:03:07.440] who got to see that. So, I'm sure I I'm
[01:03:10.320] actually looking forward to seeing them
[01:03:11.600] at Contact and being able to go, "Man,
[01:03:13.800] you guys, that triangle we saw was I was
[01:03:15.720] so good." I mean, it wasn't a solid
[01:03:17.600] structure craft. It was three objects in
[01:03:19.280] formation. When I say we've seen
[01:03:22.040] triangle structure crafts six times,
[01:03:23.600] that's solid solid structure. Yeah. So,
[01:03:28.080] why do you think Sedona is such a hot
[01:03:29.640] spot outside of military presence? Do
[01:03:31.400] you think there's natural reasons why
[01:03:33.000] the environment might be such a hotbed
[01:03:34.720] for this activity?
[01:03:36.280] Oh, gosh. Okay. Sedona has always been a
[01:03:38.840] hot spot for sightings. There are places
[01:03:41.400] in the world that will be hot spots for
[01:03:43.440] like days, you know, like all of a
[01:03:44.640] sudden you'll get a sighting wave. A
[01:03:46.600] sighting wave can last days. It can last
[01:03:48.600] weeks. It can last months. It can last
[01:03:50.720] years.
[01:03:52.320] Then there are places on the planet that
[01:03:53.880] are true hot spots, meaning there's like
[01:03:56.040] sighting waves there for epochs of time,
[01:03:58.120] where like a thousand years reported.
[01:04:00.760] Or since, you know, since the beginning
[01:04:02.360] of recorded time. And And And so, there
[01:04:04.600] are these places on the planet that are
[01:04:05.960] always known for having sightings all
[01:04:07.840] the time. Sedona is one of those.
[01:04:10.120] Northern Arizona is one of those.
[01:04:12.760] And And the leading theory as to why
[01:04:15.080] Sedona is this hot spot for epochs of
[01:04:18.480] time is our vortexes, which are these
[01:04:20.800] increased electromagnetic fields
[01:04:22.520] spiraling up from the ground.
[01:04:24.440] And that that's why. But, Sedona and
[01:04:27.840] Northern Arizona and the Four Corners
[01:04:29.720] area is all a big hot spot. And as well
[01:04:33.000] as, you know, many places in the world.
[01:04:34.880] I could go on listing them, but there's
[01:04:36.440] a lot of these places. And they're all
[01:04:38.520] places that are known as places of
[01:04:40.040] power. These places with these large
[01:04:42.120] electromagnetic increased
[01:04:43.880] electromagnetic fields.
[01:04:45.800] And so, just like those other places in
[01:04:48.640] the world with the increased
[01:04:49.640] electromagnetic fields are hot spots for
[01:04:52.560] epochs of time, so is Sedona. And then,
[01:04:54.960] there's kind of two schools of thought.
[01:04:56.640] We don't really know why, but there are
[01:04:58.120] two schools of thought. One is they're
[01:04:59.320] getting sight some kind of energy from
[01:05:01.040] it. Maybe. I'm not a big proponent of
[01:05:02.920] that, but I can't say who, you know,
[01:05:05.080] what do I know? Maybe. And then the
[01:05:06.920] other is that they're using them as
[01:05:08.880] navigation beacons. They're They're like
[01:05:11.280] coming into Earth's atmosphere. I had an
[01:05:13.720] engineering guy one night come out of my
[01:05:15.400] tour who said, "What if their
[01:05:16.720] anti-gravity navigation system is just
[01:05:19.240] locking on to these electromagnetic
[01:05:21.880] fields?" Their navigation system being
[01:05:23.960] electromagnetic is locking on to these
[01:05:26.280] electromagnetic fields and that's why
[01:05:28.040] when they come into Earth's atmosphere,
[01:05:30.400] they come into these places of power and
[01:05:32.400] then maybe redirect from there. And I
[01:05:34.640] said, "Man, that makes perfect sense."
[01:05:37.160] So, I think I think that made perfect
[01:05:39.280] sense. So, that's what I think they're
[01:05:40.400] doing. Yeah, that is intriguing for
[01:05:42.440] sure. I mean, that pretty much does it
[01:05:44.120] for us, Melinda. This has been really
[01:05:46.120] insightful. I appreciate you sharing all
[01:05:48.000] this research with us. Are there any
[01:05:49.400] links or contact information you'd like
[01:05:51.200] to give people before we call it a wrap?
[01:05:53.640] So, the best way to get a hold of me to
[01:05:56.000] access all my information is to go to my
[01:05:58.640] website ufosightingtours.com.
[01:06:02.360] And when you go to ufosightingtours.com,
[01:06:04.360] you scroll down. I got videos in my
[01:06:07.120] There's a little brief bio down the page
[01:06:08.920] aways and that bio has links in it and
[01:06:12.720] that'll take you to to all my stuff,
[01:06:15.040] basically.
[01:06:16.320] Awesome. Well,
[01:06:18.400] have a great time at Contact in the
[01:06:20.240] Desert and hopefully I can end up on one
[01:06:21.880] of those UFO tours eventually. But
[01:06:23.760] Yeah, great. Come to Sedona. I mean, you
[01:06:25.720] know, there's a million reasons to come
[01:06:27.240] to Sedona.
[01:06:28.360] Of course, my tour is being one of them.
[01:06:30.160] Right.
[01:06:30.640] But but there's there's Sedona is a is a
[01:06:33.360] destination. It's an amazing location.
[01:06:36.360] It's very spiritual. It's very healing,
[01:06:38.440] very metaphysical, rock and incredible
[01:06:40.600] outdoor enthusiast, hiking and dirt bike
[01:06:43.840] destination, as well as an art community
[01:06:47.040] destination. So,
[01:06:48.800] come to Sedona. Come on my tour. I'd
[01:06:50.880] love to take you. Right on. It's not too
[01:06:52.760] far, so I will do that. And anyone
[01:06:54.520] coming to Contact in the Desert, make
[01:06:56.360] sure you come up to me and say hi. I'm
[01:06:58.320] going to be running two free
[01:07:00.680] night vision experiences there at the
[01:07:03.360] location on Friday and Saturday nights
[01:07:05.440] and then Sunday night a paid one where
[01:07:08.000] we're going to go out to giant rock but
[01:07:09.560] you'll have goggle use the entire time.
[01:07:11.560] You won't have to at the other ones
[01:07:13.240] you're going to have goggles for like 5
[01:07:14.400] minutes at a time every 15 minutes you
[01:07:16.640] might get them for 5 minutes. So you
[01:07:18.320] might have
[01:07:19.360] three or four five minutes segments in a
[01:07:21.720] 3-hour period, you know, blah blah blah.
[01:07:23.440] You'll get to look. But it when we go
[01:07:25.360] out to giant rock on Sunday night,
[01:07:26.920] that's a paid event, but you get you'll
[01:07:29.280] have goggles usage the whole 2 hours
[01:07:31.120] that you view. I mean we'll be out there
[01:07:32.320] for like three but 2 hours of viewing
[01:07:33.960] you'll get goggle usage the whole time.
[01:07:35.800] Yeah, it's worth doing. I've looked into
[01:07:38.160] getting goggles myself but man, they are
[01:07:40.360] so expensive. The ones I've seen are
[01:07:42.000] like $10,000. So I can understand
[01:07:44.360] no, no, no. Gen Gen 3s
[01:07:47.040] uh right now are ranging between about
[01:07:50.600] 30
[01:07:51.720] I was going to say 3600 4600. Maybe it's
[01:07:53.840] more like 38 and 4800. But they're
[01:07:56.800] good Gen 3s are in that range. You can
[01:07:58.800] get souped up Gen 2s for like 2500 but I
[01:08:02.320] actually don't recommend it if you're
[01:08:03.560] serious about really doing this all the
[01:08:04.960] time.
[01:08:06.040] But some people say those are pretty
[01:08:07.360] good. I I'm not a big fan but some
[01:08:09.560] people say they're good and and I hear
[01:08:11.160] that they're getting better so I'm maybe
[01:08:12.600] I'll be turned around on it.
[01:08:14.480] But I use Gen 3s. I get ones that would
[01:08:17.319] retail right now for about 3800. I admit
[01:08:20.080] I have a contact I get them for less
[01:08:21.319] than that but and it but yeah um and
[01:08:23.600] that's what I use on the tour. All right
[01:08:25.240] on. Very cool. All right, well until
[01:08:27.200] that tour, take care of yourself out
[01:08:28.880] there. Thank you. Well, thanks again for
[01:08:30.680] having me.
[01:08:33.400] Boom people, Melinda Leslie, big thanks
[01:08:35.720] to her. You know I like the episodes to
[01:08:37.799] be pretty wildly varied and this episode
[01:08:40.960] along with last week's with Eve Logan
[01:08:42.799] are a bit too similar but that's
[01:08:44.799] nobody's fault but mine. This really was
[01:08:47.120] me trying to follow up on a lead from
[01:08:49.279] Robert Guffy. I thought we might get a
[01:08:51.520] little insight into these lesser known
[01:08:54.080] companies that might be part of the
[01:08:55.480] agenda, maybe get deeper than what's
[01:08:57.839] commonly discussed on Coast to Coast and
[01:09:00.600] some of the surface programs that talk
[01:09:03.120] about this stuff all the time, but
[01:09:04.720] apparently, the things I wanted to
[01:09:06.759] follow up on most were kind of old news.
[01:09:09.680] But, there were some insights about why
[01:09:11.720] these things occur and where pockets of
[01:09:14.160] the shadow state might be in carrying
[01:09:16.560] out this partnered agenda. Sometimes, I
[01:09:19.799] do get critics that say all I do is plug
[01:09:22.640] books, but it's hard to get into the
[01:09:25.319] level of depth that I like to when a
[01:09:28.359] guest hasn't written a ton of material
[01:09:30.200] that I can comb through. Those details
[01:09:32.720] are always nice. What sort of technology
[01:09:34.960] are people seeing? How are they
[01:09:36.720] interacting with it? What imagery and
[01:09:39.000] messages are people being given? You
[01:09:41.279] know, I would have liked to dig into
[01:09:43.880] those areas a little bit deeper as much
[01:09:46.400] as possible. In the plus show, we did
[01:09:48.839] talk largely about Melinda's own
[01:09:50.560] personal experience with both types of
[01:09:52.440] phenomenon, as well as her penchant for
[01:09:55.040] contacting spirit guides and how those
[01:09:57.160] two things might intersect. It's always
[01:09:59.760] great to hear the details of personal
[01:10:01.480] accounts and try to flush out some of
[01:10:03.560] the big picture. So, I do appreciate her
[01:10:06.560] going through that for us. I do worry
[01:10:08.840] parts of the episode were a bit too
[01:10:10.360] introductory for you guys. This isn't
[01:10:12.200] the first time you've heard of the
[01:10:14.240] Milabs experience and you're definitely
[01:10:16.120] not new to the ET abduction phenomenon,
[01:10:18.960] but I hope we got beyond the basics
[01:10:20.640] enough to keep you interested. It's hard
[01:10:22.280] to get answers sometimes because nobody
[01:10:24.400] really knows much more than the basics
[01:10:26.760] on subjects of such high secrecy. I
[01:10:29.440] mean, Melinda is someone who researches
[01:10:31.160] this stuff intensely, has interviewed
[01:10:33.880] tons of experiencers, and she's given us
[01:10:36.680] all she knows. Surprise, surprise,
[01:10:39.320] humanoid beings taking people in the
[01:10:41.280] night is something that's hard to get a
[01:10:43.120] lot of details on. And again, I respect
[01:10:45.960] the work Melinda has done and her
[01:10:47.600] opinions, but I don't think you can take
[01:10:50.520] any comments about UFO disclosure from
[01:10:52.720] Hillary Clinton seriously. I don't
[01:10:54.560] consider her to be on team people in any
[01:10:57.160] sense of the word and I would never
[01:10:59.120] suggest that getting her in office would
[01:11:01.040] do anything good for us especially not
[01:11:03.600] the revealing of secrets that are
[01:11:06.280] decades old unless of course they were
[01:11:08.400] stored on her private internet server.
[01:11:11.480] And you did get a taste of some of the
[01:11:13.120] material in tomorrow's show with Gordon
[01:11:15.920] when I asked about disclosure or
[01:11:18.360] technological rollout indicators like
[01:11:20.600] the Trans-Pacific Partnership. I think
[01:11:22.600] that's really smart thinking on Gordon's
[01:11:25.080] part and we'll get deeper into that in
[01:11:27.120] the next show.
[01:11:28.600] It was also nice to have Melinda bring
[01:11:30.400] up Corey Goode's name in this episode. A
[01:11:32.440] lot of people have written me and asked
[01:11:34.200] why I haven't had him on especially when
[01:11:36.640] the inner earth is such a big part of
[01:11:38.400] his thing.
[01:11:40.360] I just don't know if I trust his story.
[01:11:42.240] We have a lot of people come out on the
[01:11:43.920] conspiracy stage and talk about their
[01:11:46.320] wild tales. Corey Goode, Donald
[01:11:48.560] Marshall, Captain K, Andy Basiago.
[01:11:52.040] I don't really trust these guys. Their
[01:11:53.600] stories are too sensational,
[01:11:55.880] unverifiable and yeah, sometimes they
[01:11:58.440] make for a good THC. I won't deny that
[01:12:01.240] that's a part of our roster here. But
[01:12:03.800] they're not usually my favorite episodes
[01:12:05.800] and I'm realizing I'm better off with
[01:12:08.920] in-depth researchers and authors that I
[01:12:11.080] respect and find to be logical and
[01:12:13.600] intelligent rather than sensational and
[01:12:17.120] over the top. So that's where my head's
[01:12:19.360] been at in picking the guests for June.
[01:12:22.200] I think that's what worked so well for
[01:12:24.080] us in April.
[01:12:25.560] And I think you'll be pretty happy. But
[01:12:27.360] Melinda's tours are
[01:12:29.720] another thing. I haven't been out with
[01:12:31.640] her personally, but I've done the exact
[01:12:34.000] same thing twice and it is really
[01:12:36.000] interesting. I actually think it's less
[01:12:38.040] impressive than I expected, but there's
[01:12:41.080] no doubt little points of light that do
[01:12:43.720] right angle turns, move back and forth,
[01:12:46.040] change speed and direction, but they're
[01:12:48.200] so small you can't tell if they're
[01:12:50.760] really just points of light or
[01:12:53.840] some type of craft. I mean an airplane
[01:12:56.240] at night looks like a point of light,
[01:12:58.200] especially the higher up it is, but
[01:13:00.520] something's clearly there. Maybe it's
[01:13:02.000] the Archons maintenance crew, but the
[01:13:04.200] fact that they have a near perfect
[01:13:06.560] sighting record tells you that it's
[01:13:08.200] something that's always up there, and
[01:13:10.280] that in itself is something to walk away
[01:13:12.600] pondering. And treat yourself to the
[01:13:14.680] experience if you get the chance. Why
[01:13:17.000] would you not? But, that is it for me.
[01:13:20.080] You're getting two more shows in the
[01:13:22.000] next 5 days. We had scheduling issues,
[01:13:24.760] so I'm all backed up, but I'm hitting
[01:13:27.080] you with a flood of THC episodes. So,
[01:13:29.840] brace yourself. Until then, your move
[01:13:32.960] corporate alien cooperators and
[01:13:34.640] abduction overseers. Your move.
[01:13:40.720] Woke up this morning with light in my
[01:13:45.720] eyes, and then realized
[01:13:49.560] it was dark
[01:13:51.240] outside.
[01:13:55.120] It was light
[01:13:57.720] coming down from the sky.
[01:14:01.760] I don't know
[01:14:03.680] who or why.
[01:14:09.600] Must be those strangers that come every
[01:14:14.360] night.
[01:14:15.920] Whose sausage shaped light
[01:14:19.360] put people
[01:14:21.480] up tight.
[01:14:23.880] Leave
[01:14:24.720] blue green footprints that
[01:14:27.480] glow in the dark.
[01:14:30.240] I hope they get home all right.
[01:14:37.840] Hey.
[01:14:40.560] Mr. Spaceman.
[01:14:44.200] Won't you please take me along.
[01:14:48.280] I won't do anything wrong.
[01:14:52.280] Hey,
[01:14:54.960] Mr. Spaceman,
[01:14:58.720] won't you please take me along the high
[01:15:03.480] side?
[01:15:07.360] Woke up this morning,
[01:15:10.000] I was
[01:15:10.840] feeling quite weird. I had flies in my
[01:15:15.720] beer.
[01:15:17.120] My toothpaste
[01:15:18.840] was sweet.
[01:15:22.040] I opened my window late.
[01:15:25.240] Written my name.
[01:15:27.800] Said,
[01:15:28.840] "So long.
[01:15:30.600] We'll see you up again."
[01:15:35.640] Hey,
[01:15:38.320] Mr. Spaceman,
[01:15:41.960] won't you please take me along?
[01:15:46.040] I won't do anything wrong.
[01:15:50.040] Hey,
[01:15:52.760] Mr. Spaceman,
[01:15:56.440] won't you please take me along
[01:15:59.800] the high
[01:16:01.200] side?
[01:16:04.480] Hey,
[01:16:07.200] Mr. Spaceman,
[01:16:10.800] won't you please take me along?
[01:16:14.800] I won't do anything wrong.
[01:16:18.880] Hey,
[01:16:21.600] Mr. Spaceman,
[01:16:25.280] won't you please take me along the high
[01:16:30.520] side?
[01:16:32.520] Won't you please
[01:16:36.600] take me along
[01:16:39.640] the high
[01:16:42.320] side?
[01:16:56.960] Hey guys, thanks for listening to the
[01:16:58.360] first hour of the Higher Side Chats
[01:17:00.040] podcast with me, Greg Carlwood. If you
[01:17:02.480] don't know, there is a second hour to
[01:17:04.240] all the episodes we do around here.
[01:17:06.240] Generally, we're able to get a lot
[01:17:07.680] deeper into the topics and ideas that a
[01:17:09.640] guest is about. So, if you enjoyed what
[01:17:11.760] you've heard from THC for free, consider
[01:17:14.440] signing up at the
[01:17:15.320] highersidechatsplus.com
[01:17:17.160] to get the second hour of the five shows
[01:17:19.160] I put together each month. I never
[01:17:21.560] really wanted to be a paid subscriber
[01:17:23.160] podcast, but I really hate the idea of
[01:17:25.160] spending airtime promoting some product
[01:17:27.240] that's completely
[01:17:29.000] telling you the best way to support the
[01:17:30.520] show is to buy an audiobook or new
[01:17:32.920] underwear by mail or something crazy
[01:17:34.880] like that. So, instead, if you like the
[01:17:36.760] show, double your time with it for five
[01:17:38.880] bucks a month and let's cut out all the
[01:17:40.680] other It's half the price of a
[01:17:42.440] movie ticket and you get at least an
[01:17:43.960] extra five hours of show a month.
[01:17:46.240] Collectively, it keeps us stable and it
[01:17:48.160] frees me from wasting your time with
[01:17:49.960] anything but the show you came to listen
[01:17:51.600] to. It's really the only way for an
[01:17:53.880] independent one-man show to make it, and
[01:17:56.280] I do what I can so that it's worth your
[01:17:57.840] while. Since we started this, I've
[01:17:59.920] always tried to use the subscriptions to
[01:18:01.840] improve the podcast and make sign-ups
[01:18:03.920] more advantageous. It started with just
[01:18:06.360] a second hour for the main show, but now
[01:18:08.440] we've got a nice forum going where
[01:18:10.000] people can get deeper in conversation
[01:18:12.040] about the episodes with other listeners,
[01:18:14.320] submit a candidate in the guest request
[01:18:16.800] thread, or share their own personal
[01:18:18.960] projects to get out of the soul-crushing
[01:18:20.840] 9-to-5 cog in the wheel life on the
[01:18:23.080] entrepreneurs thread. The forum and the
[01:18:25.360] plus comments are always the first
[01:18:27.040] places I try to go for listener
[01:18:28.640] engagement, but it does get harder as
[01:18:30.960] the show gets more popular. Because of
[01:18:33.120] that, there's also a direct messaging
[01:18:34.880] feature that you can use to reach me
[01:18:36.280] through the plus site, also.
[01:18:38.400] But, beyond the forum, if you like any
[01:18:39.920] of the music I've used for THC, most of
[01:18:42.040] it I've hired artists to make, and I
[01:18:43.960] provide it all as free downloads to plus
[01:18:45.920] members, too. So, if you like a
[01:18:47.560] particular song you've heard close the
[01:18:49.160] show out recently, come get the MP3. I
[01:18:52.120] should also mention that if you don't
[01:18:53.560] like the idea of paying $5 recurring
[01:18:55.840] every month, I get that. You can buy 3
[01:18:58.240] months, 6 months, or a year up front and
[01:19:00.600] just be done with it. I have plenty of
[01:19:02.640] listeners who send checks and money
[01:19:04.080] orders to the PO box, too. I try to make
[01:19:06.680] it as easy for people as I can, and you
[01:19:08.560] can read more about it on the sign-up
[01:19:10.040] page. Also, be sure to check out the FAQ
[01:19:12.680] help page on the plus site if you have
[01:19:14.480] any questions or concerns about how to
[01:19:16.360] listen to a password-protected show on
[01:19:18.200] your devices. I've highlighted a lot of
[01:19:20.520] great solutions, and one of those would
[01:19:22.520] be the iPhone app that just recently hit
[01:19:24.920] the Apple App Store. A super kind and
[01:19:27.600] talented listener made it for us, and
[01:19:29.640] you can use it to stream or download
[01:19:31.440] either the free or the plus show. If
[01:19:33.480] you're on Android, I'd use Pocket Casts
[01:19:35.760] or Podcast Addict, and subscribe to the
[01:19:38.120] feed manually that way. I also try to
[01:19:40.520] throw in occasional bonus shows or Q&A
[01:19:43.040] shows, and I've got a few other weird
[01:19:44.840] ideas I might get to try out soon, but I
[01:19:47.280] give you all I can for five bucks, and I
[01:19:49.160] hope you'll at least give it a shot if
[01:19:50.840] you've listened to a few free shows and
[01:19:52.560] you find them unique or valuable. I know
[01:19:54.440] there's a lot of podcasts out there, and
[01:19:56.080] I'm just one of them.
[01:19:57.600] But, if you have any questions,
[01:19:58.840] concerns, or comments about any of this,
[01:20:00.720] please get in touch with us at the
[01:20:02.080] highersidechats@gmail.com.
[01:20:05.480] I also wanted to plug the higher side
[01:20:07.040] newsletter I'm going to be putting out,
[01:20:08.440] totally free for anyone who wants to
[01:20:10.200] sign up at the main internet website for
[01:20:12.560] the show, the highersidechats.com.
[01:20:15.120] You can also get on that email list
[01:20:16.840] through the highersidechats Facebook
[01:20:18.480] page. There's a button there, as well.
[01:20:20.760] But, the reason I'm doing this is
[01:20:21.880] because I get tons and tons of emails
[01:20:24.200] after a show goes up asking me about how
[01:20:26.240] I feel about a particular guest or
[01:20:27.960] topic, and the wrap-up isn't always the
[01:20:29.880] best place to do that, especially if I
[01:20:31.920] have anything negative to say. Sometimes
[01:20:33.720] the dust needs to settle. Sometimes I
[01:20:35.760] need to hear feedback from you guys
[01:20:37.280] first. There are a lot of factors, but I
[01:20:39.760] usually have something to communicate to
[01:20:41.520] you and I just don't get to do it. So,
[01:20:43.840] on the first of the month, I plan to
[01:20:45.320] send out a little newsletter with my
[01:20:46.800] thoughts about the five shows the
[01:20:48.320] previous month and talk to you about
[01:20:50.400] anything else that's on my mind or
[01:20:52.160] that's going on.
[01:20:53.640] And what's probably most enticing is
[01:20:55.400] that I'm going to give you some insight
[01:20:56.920] into at least one guest I have coming up
[01:20:58.960] in the month, which people have been
[01:21:00.680] begging for some posted schedule for a
[01:21:02.680] long time. I personally think I'd like
[01:21:04.960] the surprise. But, sign up for the
[01:21:06.640] Higher Side newsletter. It's free. It
[01:21:08.480] comes out on the first of the month and
[01:21:09.960] I won't waste your time with any other
[01:21:11.680] emails.
[01:21:12.960] And that's it. I appreciate you
[01:21:14.360] listening. I try to give alternative
[01:21:16.040] ideas and guests a fair shake on a
[01:21:18.000] high-quality podcast, expose some
[01:21:20.320] deep-level conspiracies without the
[01:21:22.080] yelling, and I hope to offer some
[01:21:23.960] inspiration that even though the system
[01:21:25.760] relentlessly suggests you should follow
[01:21:27.800] their blueprint to mediocrity, you can
[01:21:30.160] do your own thing and live a much
[01:21:31.720] happier life despite all the negativity
[01:21:33.920] in the world. So, go ahead and treat
[01:21:35.840] yourself.